Chaos - Balance and Suggestions Thread - Ultimate Apocalypse Mod (DOW SS) for Dawn of War

Use this thread specifically to talk about the faction; Chaos. The Ultimate Apocalypse mod includes 12 factions in total. We require your personal feedback to improve each and every faction. This thread will definitely help us improve this faction in the future, so if there is no discussion about this faction, it is possible to assume that this faction is perfect as is. We want your every opinion, constructive criticism, and thoughts to make this faction better!

No new content requests are allowed.
No bashing.

What do you feel this race lacks?
What needs to be nerfed?
What needs a buff?

Balance in general - rate out of 10 and state why?

All questions are optional by your choosing. Feel free to also talk about something else not mentioned, but only about this faction! This faction while fighting another race is acceptable.

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Edited by: Lord_Cylarne

There are cases wherein Chaos Lord loses the ability to train honor guards... It happens rarely but I am unsure what the problem is

I've noticed that the chaos lord wargear the Khorne Axe can be researched before hero level 5, perhaps many have noticed this but eitherway just in case, letting you all know.

Someone wrote: There are cases wherein Chaos Lord loses the ability to train honor
guards... It happens rarely but I am unsure what the problem is

Yep, need more information about that...

I think the Khoprneaxe and Meltagun was intentional to be researched at level 4, however, that may be unfair to other races. Yeah this will get a nerf.

10/10

No major flaws as I can tell.

When you upgrade the reaver titan with the plasma cannon it appears clipping through the galtling gun and the reaver can fire both, bug or intentional?

Greetings. I find it odd the Chaos Lord (or any of the commanders in skirmishes) have been given names. I would like to ask why this decision was made and why not have the commanders be nameless. I usually like to think of my own names for them and just keep that tucked in the back of my mind.

Also, any plans for Marked Chaos Lords? Such as you pick the mark of Nurgle, the Chaos Lord changes to be Nurgle type Lord, and vice versa for the gods.

I have been running tests since I posted the Commanders-have-no-honor-guards problem... I may have isolated the cause; right-clicking (auto-build) on the commander's icon instead of left-clicking... Still being proven but so far, it "works"

just the commander is the problem... no honor guards being produce double check it with the checklist on gametype list..

Chaos is now PRETTY much done, folks. Honor Guard problem will be looked into.

Given names to commanders will soon to be removed then, I agree, I'm sorry.

New features were added to them last time I posted the change log. New changelog will come soon I dunno when.

Someone wrote: When you upgrade the reaver titan with the plasma cannon it appears clipping through the galtling gun and the reaver can fire both, bug or intentional?

Pfff, new Chaos Reaver Titan ingame! Bug report ignored. :p

banelord titan???

I think the Sorceres move a bit too quick (perhaps this is because all updates were got?) I might be biased from high fantasy but I'd say that spellcasters should be majestic and royal, even of chaos.
also, could the sorcerer lord be equipped with a scythe? and have more upgrades?

is it normal that the Chaos lord can tranform into a demon even if one does not choose the Mark of Chaos undivided?

I think the Meteor Storm should inflict a biut more damage it's too small aven if it does send units flying away

Can the Storm of Change get a revamped texture, based on meteor storm, so that it does not look the same with the Eldar Storm?

how about giving more upgrades to the various chaos sorcerorS, in addition to the lord?

Edited by: Dark_Ansem

I find myself never researching the Daemon Prince ascension upgrade (which is a shame because he looks so cool!) as he is less useful than the Chaos lord with his shields on. I know you are nerfing all commanders for 1.72 so maybe this isn't an issue anymore, but please check to see if getting Daemon Prince makes you have a stronger commander because right now you're just putting yourself at a disadvantage if you do.

not possible to make more power differentiation between the various Marks for sorcerers and sorcerer lords, right? such as the storm which changes stuff into enemies shown here
Wh40k.lexicanum.com

EDIT: also to have the Thousand Sons color scheme and emblem?

Edited by: Dark_Ansem

Forums.relicnews.com

Archivist wrote: You are in luck I was just lurking here after a year of inactivity.
I recently restarted modding and unrandomized the codex chaos lord.
This whe file will force the correct helmets for all marks. In addition:

Vis_Undivided will always generate the head from DOW vanilla
Vis_Word_Bearers will always generate Undivided Helmet
Vis_Alpha_Legion will always generate alpha legion helmet
Vis_Night_Lords will always generate night lords helmet
Vis_Iron_Warriors will always generate warsmith

Backpacks will be generated as 2x skulls + 2x skullpoles + banner, nurgle, slaanesh, wb and iw use their own.
I also unrandomized the melee weapons, use the following references on hardpoint 2:

name_for_this_weapon_choice =
chaos_chainsword
chaos_power_sword = regular powersword
chaos_daemon_weapon = blue sword
chaos_blissgiver = slaanesh sword
chaos_dark_blade = daemon prince sword
chaos_plague_sword = nurgle sword
chaos_manreaper = nurgle scythe
chaos_bedlam_staff = sorcerer staff
chaos_deathscreamer = tzeentch weapon
chaos_axe_of_khorne = khorne axe 1
chaos_bloodfeeder = khorne axe 2
chaos_berserker_glaive = khorne axe 3
chaos_dreadaxe
chaos_accursed_crozius
chaos_lightning_claw
chaos_power_fist

Link: Mediafire.com

Edited by: RT2...

-One of the Chaos Lord's wargear (the Daemonic Rune) says it requires the Armor of Alpharius, but can be researched/purchased even if the armor isn't.
-The Chaos Predator's Missile Launcher doesn't work; the missile is shot at a random direction.
-The Hell Drake only uses its bottom cannons (fireballs) when forced by using "attack ground" (and also breathes pink cubes, but I believe that's already known)
-The Renegades' mortar weapon slot has no icon, and I believe the delay between the mortar shots is way too short (when fully equipped with mortars, they shoot faster and more accurately than a WhirlWind barrage)
-The Deathwheel spins extremely fast for it's actual movement speed in my opinion (and when using rampage doesn't spin at all)
-And I find just cruel that the Obliterators have no building limit D:

Other than that, the rest were just superficial errors, like:

Descriptions:
-Chaos Cultist: "Only numerous in large numbers" (wtf xD)
-Chaos Lord: "Able to possess the Daemon Prince"
-Chaos Sorceror (sorcerer?): "Can possess the Bloodthirster", "...able to use massive amounts the more..." (missing something between "amounts" and "the more")
-Renegades: "Has almost weak morale", "Relies on other units to be provided protection" (I'm not sure about these ones; English is not my main language, but they don't seem right to me)

And would be possible to remove the dialog line "The Emperor is with us" from the Chaos Warhound's speech? Hearing it say that made me accidentally press his "self-destruct" button.

For Chaos, I just went around fixing bugs, preparing for my plans in 1.73. I never really gave a huge interest in fixing Chaos, but ever since the Space Marines new concept got done, I've been giving them some love.

As some of you mentioned, you requested the Marks to be more... diverse? That I kind of did. If you played DOW II, you will love the Cultists. Cultists now chant and explode, giving benefits to surrounding squads or murdering the enemy upon which they explode. However, I am lacking the symbol textures for the chants. Cultists have a great function of chanting the marks of Chaos which hence gives your troops great benefite to the designated mark.

Pedestals are awaiting implementation as well.

Hell Drake loud noise bug was definitely toned down.

Chaos was given the same loyalist Space Marine buffs so Chaos are not weaklings anymore.

Bloodthirster with new abilities? Hell yeah! I had some thoughts while reading through this:

Someone wrote: -The Chaos Predator's Missile Launcher doesn't work; the missile is shot at a random direction.

Uh... ?

Someone wrote: I think the Meteor Storm should inflict a biut more damage

GOD NO! OP... sorry, but the Sorceror Meteor damage was slightly nerfed for... MANY reasons.

Someone wrote: I think the Sorceres move a bit too quick (perhaps this is because all updates were got?) I might be biased from high fantasy but I'd say that spellcasters should be majestic and royal, even of chaos.

Should be no problem in 1.72. I tested all sorcerors and they were dandy. :3

Someone wrote: -And I find just cruel that the Obliterators have no building limit D:

Uh?

The rest were pretty lolzy and most of which are fixed that I can fix.

However...

Someone wrote: I find myself never researching the Daemon Prince ascension upgrade (which is a shame because he looks so cool!) as he is less useful than the Chaos lord with his shields on. I know you are nerfing all commanders for 1.72 so maybe this isn't an issue anymore, but please check to see if getting Daemon Prince makes you have a stronger commander because right now you're just putting yourself at a disadvantage if you do.

THAT my friend I am still trying to fix.

Thanks for feedback.

Unable to repair Shrines of Khorne. Is this intended?

Nope. Noted.

I haven't exactly tested it, but I just wanted to make sure.. do special chaos marines (plague marines, rubric marines, etc.) benefit from any of the upgrades in the armory? I know the upgrade that increases melee damage only applies to the standard chaos marines. Can you make it that it applies to all of them? Especially Khorne berserkers.

Can you give the culttroops the color of their legion? eg. berserkers red-golden, and one shoulderpad has the color and sign of the army scheme. The next point I noticed is the reaver has a shorter buildtime than the warhound, I think you should swap that. Then the new ability of the culitsts seems very strong to me, I was able to fight back a complete ork waagh with a couple of tanks and marines. My suggestion is to limit the regeneration to infantry and restrict it for tanks. And last it seems to me (but I'm not sure about that) that the citadel is olny shooting in an area of 180° and not 360°.

Two in my opinion very important point about Chaos (in 1.72).1) I think the Cultists require a new leader unit. This is because the Aspiring Champions move as slowly as the rest of the Chaos Marines (which makes sense) but sadly this actually limits the movement speed of all the cultists to his speed. Thus having a new leader unit for the cultists (like some sort of special cultist) would solve this.2) I very highly recommend you remove the ability to select more than 1 mark (you select to build a unit and then are able to cue all the marks). It is over powered and this is coming from a player who's faveourite race is Chaos! To give just one example: The cultists gain all the worship abilities which applied all at once are devastating.
Thanks for reading

what what what we can worship more than 1 mark??

I noticed that the research upgrade for infiltrated chaos marine squads no long does anything (except take up upgrade time =) ). This still works for the heretics, but Ive always considered sneaky tactical squads to be a lot of fun.

LOVE the new heretic abilities, but could there perhaps be an animation for the sacrificed heretic's doomblast? Seems a pity to put them in the ground without a little flashy bit of heresy to accompany them.

Other than that, really great! Sorcerer Lord at level 10 can take out a whole base with one spell, lol...

EDIT: I volunteer to spell check and/or write unit lore for the descriptions. Spelling errors and grammar abound >.>

Edited by: SoulsForSlaanesh

Hi, the high speed constructors, the motorbike and the anywhere deploy raptors are a brutal and superquick rush. Most of times its so easy to take the already captured points of the enemy cause take it back have preference over build on it.