Report article RSS Feed L4D2 Boycott Group emails Valve with their demands

The famous L4D2 Boycott Group emails Valve with a manifesto. The group has is angry about the newly coming game L4D2 after a year of release of L4D. The group has gone up to 15,000 members with the number increasing exponentially.

Posted by selman_akinci on Jun 7th, 2009


We have stated this in our last article but let me take it back to the beginning.
In E3 2009, Valve anounced a release date for L4D2 (Left 4 Dead 2) In accordance, consumers of the original game; L4D responded with a boycott group.


Boycott group has become "The Talk" not only among people with L4D but also among the ones who dont own it in addition to many famous gaming websites. The group initially started growing after the thousand mark, it quickly developed and in five days it reached 10,000 members. Currently the group is holding 15,000 members (By 6/7/09) and the number keeps growing exponentially.

EDIT: New member count; 20,065 (6/11/09)

As for the main purpose of this news; Today, the group mailed Valve with their demands of the situation with a manifesto consisting of 14 general points in one page. Hopefully if the mail doesnt end up in one of the filters, spam boxes or junk folder we might first time in the world as the community have a say in our products.

The situation is somewhat fortunate for the group because this has turned into a formal fight of community vs company. Therefore many gamers who have not even played Left 4 Dead wants to change Valve's so called "Milking the consumers"

Here is the manifesto, I am not sure if it was sent in this format but these are points included;

Group's wrote:This manifesto was created by user "afternine" with slight modification by the L4D2 boycott staff. It has since been sent to Valve staff:

We Recognize:

-Valve is a company with financial needs and cannot be expected to survive without the release of new games.

-Judgment cannot be passed on the quality of Left 4 Dead 2 until its release.

-Left 4 Dead was, and is, a quality game which deserves the praise of the entire gaming community.

We Are Committed:

-To holding Valve to its promise of free, continual updates to Left 4 Dead in order to build and sustain the community.

-To keeping the Left 4 Dead community together in order to improve the quality of online gaming.

-To supporting the model of continual updates Valve has set forth with its staple products like Team Fortress 2.

We Believe:

-The release of Left 4 Dead 2 as a stand-alone sequel will split the communities and decrease the quality of multiplayer gaming.

-The announced content of Left 4 Dead 2 does not warrant a stand-alone, full-priced sequel and should instead become updates (free or otherwise) for Left 4 Dead.

-Left 4 Dead has not yet received the support and content which Valve has repeatedly stated will be delivered.

-The release of Left 4 Dead 2 will make Left 4 Dead an obsolete purchase and inferior piece of software after only one year since release.

We Request:

-That Valve honor its commitment to release ongoing periodic content for Left 4 Dead.

-That Left 4 Dead 2 not be released as a stand-alone, full-priced sequel but as either a free update to Left 4 Dead or an expansion with full compatibility with basic Left 4 Dead owners.

-That Left 4 Dead owners be given discounts for Left 4 Dead 2, should it be released as premium content.

Therefore, we - the members of this Left 4 Dead 2 Boycott - promise to abstain from the purchase of Left 4 Dead 2 until our requests are addressed.


This is for now as we enter the second week of this boycott. I wil try to keep Moddb Community informed about this first in the world. Images are not by me and I do not take responsibility for them.


EDIT: I wasn't planning on doing this but any comments with inappropriate words will be erased regardless if you support this or not.

Post comment Comments  (0 - 50 of 314)
EvilConker
EvilConker Jun 7 2009, 11:18pm says:

Wow, you guys are idiots.
You abuse a good thing, Valve has been supporting your games for as long as they've been around, and this is how you treat them in their time of need, for shame.

-1 votes     reply to comment
selman_akinci Author
selman_akinci Jun 7 2009, 11:21pm replied:

In need? Valve is in no-way in need of money, they already get enough money from their games. They want money doesn't mean they should rip us off.. Hopefully valve will show understanding and make it cheaper and maybe even both an add-on and standalone..

-1 votes   reply to comment
EvilConker
EvilConker Jun 7 2009, 11:24pm replied:

What you guys have been getting for free for your other games is what other game communities consider expansions.

+17 votes     reply to comment
Tokoya
Tokoya Jun 7 2009, 11:29pm replied:

Yup, Valve spoiled it's kids and look whats happening when they finaly put the cookie jar away. For being generous to it's fan base while it could, it's being punished when it no longer can.

Man, what a loyal community we turned out to be!

+24 votes     reply to comment
EvilConker
EvilConker Jun 7 2009, 11:31pm buried:

(buried)

GIMMEH MEH KOOKEHS!
ur the worst parents in teh world!

-16 votes     reply to comment
Tron619
Tron619 Jun 8 2009, 12:54am replied:

I cant see to be mad about.They should be happy that valve is making a game this year.Most of the time you would see valve release a game each year.

+7 votes     reply to comment
Betelgeuze
Betelgeuze Jun 8 2009, 1:46am replied:

what valve has given us in ""firts release" is not what we would expect from other companies

+3 votes     reply to comment
sbnewsom
sbnewsom Jun 8 2009, 1:35am replied:

Not to mention Valve already stated that they will still support L4D even long after the L4D2 release.

+16 votes     reply to comment
Stealthrellik
Stealthrellik Jun 8 2009, 8:30am buried:

(buried)

thats bs, they havent even supported half the glitches on it...

-7 votes     reply to comment
QuadX
QuadX Jun 9 2009, 6:01pm replied:

Are you guys even reading and paying attention? Or do you people just join a cause just because? First off, the beta SDK is already out, before L4D2 was even released. Which means, (hello?) that they are still supporting the first game. Also, has anyone seen this yet: Giantbomb.com

+1 vote     reply to comment
Midnitte
Midnitte Jun 7 2009, 11:31pm replied:

Joystiq.com

Really? Valve needs more money?
Valve makes commission on all the sales on steam, if they need money they aren't doing it right. And if we get something for free most people consider a new game, their definition of a new game is very shallow.

+5 votes     reply to comment
EvilConker
EvilConker Jun 7 2009, 11:32pm replied:

Yeah, the spoildnes's gotten to you, consider yourself lucky that Valve's even been giving you this stuff for free, small or not, it's better then the nothing other gaming communities get (without having to pay first.)

-2 votes     reply to comment
Midnitte
Midnitte Jun 7 2009, 11:51pm replied:

Yes, I love how you try to call me spoiled when you probably didn't even look at my link. Your point that valve needs money is invalid, the fact is valve promised updates for L4D in a similar style to TF2 and now they're promising it for L4D2 which is just deja vu... Sorry if you don't like the idea of a community controlling what a company does, perhaps if the community for EA stepped up, we wouldn't have 10 battlefield games or yearly releases of every sports game from EA. GG YOU WON.

+9 votes     reply to comment
sbnewsom
sbnewsom Jun 8 2009, 1:38am replied:

Does change the fact that Valve will always be valve. There work will always show through as quality. Hence the reason why you are spoiled, for the fact that if your not fully satisfied beyond capabilities, everyone will be ****.

+6 votes     reply to comment
Dra6o0n
Dra6o0n Jun 8 2009, 1:55pm replied:

Valve does not give us that many freebies... The reason games are cheap is because Valve doesn't have to pay for packaging, marketing, etc. for those games...

Valves are still making a big buck for each sales because they are racking in like 50-90% of the profit for each sold...

So no. Valve is not in any financial trouble...

As for saying that valve is spoiling us. That exact same part has no meaning since valve also sells things ridiculously expensive too...

The reason they make games cheaper as a event is that THEY are CONFIDENT they will make a ton of money... So stop using the "spoiling" as a excuse... Idiots...

+2 votes     reply to comment
Nickelpat
Nickelpat Jun 8 2009, 2:33am replied:

It's not the fact that we need to pay for another game. It's that game contains:

A couple more campaigns (I'm guessing around 10 separate maps)
Some obnoxious, very stereotyped reviews.
Melee weapons.
3 new zombies.
Oh yeah, and there's sun.

Why am I paying 60 dollars for that? That's barely an expansion.

Valve is not honoring it's word, it's the principal, not the price.

+5 votes     reply to comment
AlCool
AlCool Jun 8 2009, 3:47am buried:

(buried)

^ You must be a part of the community ;D

-8 votes     reply to comment
Cypher05
Cypher05 Jun 8 2009, 10:15am replied:

Read interviews. ...

-3 votes     reply to comment
Nickelpat
Nickelpat Jun 8 2009, 11:10am replied:

Would you like to link them?

+5 votes     reply to comment
Kyle1212
Kyle1212 Jun 8 2009, 11:11am replied:

Yeah dude, you are way off. There is lots of new **** in the game. You people should just be happy were getting a new left4dead so soon. And if you don't want to pay 50 dollars for it. Don't. Nobody is forcing you to buy the game. Plus 2 months after launch it'll be 20-30 dollars just like the original. So buy it then. If you really wanna "stick it to the man."

+4 votes     reply to comment
Gongong
Gongong Jun 8 2009, 12:23pm replied:

Well, ain't that what a boycott is about in the first place?
They're just grouping up to show that there are many that think this way.

+6 votes     reply to comment
Nickelpat
Nickelpat Jun 8 2009, 12:57pm replied:

I'm not, that is what a boycott is, a group of people not buying the game.

That's not that much new in L4D2. The engine is the same, the gameplay is the same. It introduces new maps, models, and items. One new gameplay element. That is not a sequel.

If they added some new modes (which they didn't) maybe the option to drive some vehicles (running zombies over with a tractor would be awesome). Even something like giving the survivors the ability to carry a rope and use it to climb things.

But they didn't, the only new gameplay additions are the melee weapons and 3 new zombies. 10 maps, some new monsters, models, and one new gameplay change. That's all I saw at E3. If there's something I missed, feel free to tell me and send me a link.

0 votes     reply to comment
Arsenic43204
Arsenic43204 Jun 8 2009, 5:12pm replied:

you don't know what your talking about.

+2 votes     reply to comment
RockerFox
RockerFox Jun 8 2009, 7:08pm replied:

Humm a game was like this and no one bitched about it OH YEA. CodWaw, almost the same engine, game play, and the weapons are just the same since there are not that many ways to redo a gun. Also if you bring up the bonzzi attacks there basically the dogs from cod 4 but with guns. So please don't bitch about things being the same when other games have pulled the same act before and you had nothing to say about it.

+1 vote     reply to comment
NewMessageN00b
NewMessageN00b Jun 8 2009, 1:10pm replied:

I'll better wait 'til there's a 50% discount off the $5 bill 10 years later.

+3 votes     reply to comment
Nickelpat
Nickelpat Jun 8 2009, 12:51pm replied:

When I said reveiws I meant survivors, little, tiny typo.. :P

+1 vote     reply to comment
QuadX
QuadX Jun 9 2009, 6:16pm replied:

Nickelpat: The game is not even out yet. There's room for more content, and did you ever consider the fact that Valve didn't reveal all the new changes at E3? Hmm? Yeah, so, until the facts are revealed from valve you can't just blatantly claim that it's the same game as L4D1. I can tell you from what I've heard that you are leaving out stuff in your post.

+4 votes     reply to comment
RockerFox
RockerFox Jun 9 2009, 6:20pm replied:

don't waste your breath, the will just say " it's a business strategy" and claim your stupid (which i feel your not)

+1 vote     reply to comment
sethrulz
sethrulz Jun 13 2009, 5:18pm replied:

wow your slow, the game was just announced at E3, you don't know what else will be in it idiot, think before you speak next time.

+1 vote     reply to comment
Ndition
Ndition Jun 8 2009, 8:18am replied:

According to me the community have the right to show it's discontent, as long as you are well-mannered. The same applies to the comments.

+8 votes     reply to comment
QuadX
QuadX Jun 9 2009, 6:20pm replied:

Yes, we have the right to show discontent. Based on what facts though? There's nothing wrong with being skeptical, but to blatantly start bashing VALVe like this is crazy. I think this went a bit far to be honest.

+2 votes     reply to comment
TheHappyFriar
TheHappyFriar Jun 8 2009, 9:39am buried:

(buried)

I agree. Valve is a jerk of a company & to no one surprise (except maybe Valve now) they attracted the same type of fans.

Next they'll be going to the govt demanding Valve give them free stuff from the socialist-to-be country the company's located in.

-16 votes     reply to comment
Undying_Zombie
Undying_Zombie Jul 1 2009, 5:42pm replied:

The truth in the matter Valve did promise to its customers ( Even had a announcement via news update on steam 1 or 2 times about this ) That they where going to be adding new weapons/bosses/ ect later on to L4D. ( similar to what they have been doing to TF2. ) Instead they pool together what they have been working on and turn it into a "new" game. So yes I can see why people are upset.

The new content in L4D2 just seems more of what was said to be added into L4D at a later date. You could call it a expansion, but it really is not. Its a joke really. To me it feels like valve has been listening to EA too much as of late but what ever the case.. It does not matter, in the end it's Valve's choice.

Just seems like a stupid move by a company that is not hurting that badly money wise since they are tampering with a loyal fan base that does happen to listen to a lot of what they have to say.

All that said, oddly enough Valve is still better than most other companies when it comes to games. Very few now-a-days keep to their word on things, ( This time Valve slipped on that though. More than a little.. ) even fewer generate nothing but good games.

+1 vote     reply to comment
Docm30
Docm30 Jun 7 2009, 11:26pm buried:

(buried)

Let's boycott Episode 3 too, and maybe we can get it for free...

-7 votes     reply to comment
AlCool
AlCool Jun 8 2009, 1:25am replied:

YOu really dont need to be an idiot. This isn't L4D Ep2, its L4D reskinned and resold. It's like what EA does with DLC

-4 votes     reply to comment
sbnewsom
sbnewsom Jun 8 2009, 1:37am replied:

Oh no, maybe Battlefield 2 or Battlefield 2040 or whatever its called is just Battlefield 1942 reskinned and resold. Its still a very different game.

Or maybe Call of Duty. its just reskinned and resold. Based on what you say, even though L4D2 isn't a reskinned and resold game, all games is just that too.

+7 votes     reply to comment
AlCool
AlCool Jun 8 2009, 1:39am replied:

Have u ever played battlefield 1942? Its a bad argument with bad comparisons. BF1942, and BF2 run completely different engines. BF2142 was developed by a different branch as a completely different game with nothing based on the first 2 but the engine. There is no similarities.

You can only make the comparison to BF2 and BF2142 when they make L4D in space.

+1 vote     reply to comment
sbnewsom
sbnewsom Jun 8 2009, 1:44am buried:

(buried)

So in your world, a game can only reckon a sequel if its a totally different engine? Your a ******* idiot.

-5 votes     reply to comment
VagabondPraetor
VagabondPraetor Jun 8 2009, 1:47am replied:

Yes.

Needs enough new features and changes to detach completely from the tag 'expansion pack' or even 'add on'.

+4 votes     reply to comment
sbnewsom
sbnewsom Jun 8 2009, 1:49am buried:

(buried)

If that was the case then almost all games share majority of its features with the original game, with very few new features.

-5 votes     reply to comment
AlCool
AlCool Jun 8 2009, 1:57am replied:

You really are acting like a fool. Turn off the valve fanboy attitude and understand a single word that's being written.

You keep saying "Other games do it too" when you never list anything that backs up a single point (if you can call them that) that you have made.

READ THE MANIFESTO AND WHAT IS WRITTEN ON THE STEAM GROUP AND UNDERSTAND IT. THEN maybe you won't be sitting here making comments that make you look like a buffoon.

+5 votes     reply to comment
sbnewsom
sbnewsom Jun 8 2009, 2:04am replied:

Stop saying that the Game is just a reskinned and resold L4D.

Elite Force. Just a reskinned "ID Tech 3" engine. Oh but it has different weapons. Well you stated in another post that it isn't that hard to program in a new weapon.

Call of Duty. Redone models, different textures, different menu, replaced weapons and a simple addition of an Objective List.

Your argument is only flawed because you seem to ignore how different L4D2 is from L4D. There is so much changed underneath that it can be measured just about the same as most games based on another engine.

Lets go on.

Return to castle Wolfentstein. Oh my, its not in the future. Its during WW2. Must be very different game.

Or maybe all the games that were released as Gold editions with new features that can't be found in a patch. Oh wait, that doesn't matter.

-4 votes     reply to comment
AlCool
AlCool Jun 8 2009, 2:12am replied:

Again with bad comaprisons! Your on a roll!

First, you can't RESKIN an engine. And I made the reskinned resold comment like one? 5 or 6 comments above this one actually.

Second, your comparing games built off an engine to the game that released with the engine. When they make a new game they use the ENGINE not the GAME ok? Get it yet?

Last, the COD series is a different matter completely. A) Each game IS using a different engine developed by them. B) Each game is in a different time period entirely. C)I can see why they wouldn't want to patch COD2 with vehicles, 2 dozen new guns, 2 dozen new maps, and higher quality everything, and with a whole new compaign, multiplayer modes, player support, antilag systems, etc, like a few years LATER.

Patching something using completely different EVERYTHING is different then patching in new content to the same game. CoD2 and CoD3 are completely different games, just like CoD3 and CoD4 and up.

I'm ignorant? Because I've actually looked and read everything that's come up? Because I'm not a fanboy enough of the first to make stupid points? It's the SAME GAME. How can you not see that?

+9 votes     reply to comment
sbnewsom
sbnewsom Jun 8 2009, 2:15am buried:

(buried)

I love your posts buddy. They sound just like your scrambling for something to say, yet my post still stand. They are nothing more than games for the engine just a different surface.

-12 votes     reply to comment
AlCool
AlCool Jun 8 2009, 2:21am replied:

YOU CAN'T RESURFACE AND ENGINE. When you use BARE ID TECH 3, what does it have? Does it have quake 3 on there? No it doesn't. Because it is an ENGINE. Your statement stands in midair, plummeting into a chasm. When these FULL GAMES are made using the ENGINE, they build EVERYTHING. YOu can't even say it has anything to do with quake 3, at ALL.

+4 votes     reply to comment
sbnewsom
sbnewsom Jun 8 2009, 2:26am buried:

(buried)

You still have Skeletal templates, mapping examples, example utilities and such. Most engines come with them.

Going by your information, all games are pretty much TC's. Oh, do you know what a TC is? Going by graphical information, its doing everything from scratch. Engines still have the based information. Most engines at least have weapon templates and such just to get a developer started.

-9 votes     reply to comment
AlCool
AlCool Jun 8 2009, 2:48am replied:

Exactly. Total conversions. These games are not just that though. They have to work to a quality that a community will not see as a mod. They have quotas, standards, and cannot allow their game to be similar to any other in such a way that they can be sued. The difference between a TC and a full game though, is that the game uses the CORE engine, not the modding engine. There is a large difference in what can be done between the too.

+8 votes     reply to comment
sbnewsom
sbnewsom Jun 8 2009, 2:50am buried:

(buried)

Though a community may see it as a mod, it doesn't mean it could be a mod. It can only be considered a mod if it can be done as a mod. That said. None of the things done in L4D2 can be done in a mod.

Anyways, in reply to your post. L4D2 is a fully game. There is enough changes to the Core engine that would make it a new game. Deny it or not. All the changes by definition would make it a Game and not a Mod.

-8 votes     reply to comment
AlCool
AlCool Jun 8 2009, 3:01am replied:

No they wouldn't. If valve didn't release a limited SDK for the community they could easily have done everything in L4D2. But the limited SDK doesn't allow weapon and AI and enemy changing. Although many hoped it would if you look at some of the L4D mods on this site. Considering the time it has been since L4D's release, they really haven't added much to begin with. Even then people could have hacked the content in.

+5 votes     reply to comment
SupaNinjaMan
SupaNinjaMan Jun 8 2009, 4:54am replied:

umm, just curious, how do you KNOW they changed the core engine.
I see nothing to qualify as an engine change on there.

+8 votes     reply to comment
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