My first deathclone video - Empire At War Remake: Galactic Civil War mod for Star Wars: Empire at War: Forces of Corruption
This mod catapults Empire at War into 2077. It maintains the game's design philosophy, while adding new units, better graphics, and deeper gameplay.
My first deathclone
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Description
So, today I got a mail from someone who pointed out the obvious, that for all my so called "graphical improvement" I have no new deathclones to go with the new models I've made, so when ships blow up those improvements instantly become a bad joke.
So I'm going to attempt to fix that with a series of deathclones, this being the first. Also the first I ever made, I think it came out reasonable, much better than the standard break into 2 parts into explosion, I wanted to add a little bit more to it than that.
Enjoy,
-G
Looks good.
Overall very good, but the End explosions take the cake :3
wonderfull effects.. It really makes you feel like you have either
lost an invaluable big capital ship
or triumphed over it.. Gives some weight to it.. idk xD
GOOD JOB
Agreed
You've done well I must say. However, don't you think that the pieces travel too fast and too far?
Mmm, perhaps a little to fast, I don't think they go to far though.
Where they go is fine, like Enpremi said though they just get there at incredibly high speeds lol
I agree, they should be way slower, but the distance is good. The explosions at the end are also very cool.
PS. Boda (below) shut up, it's a game, mayby you want so that the pieces of that ship can fall to planet and destroy enemy ground base while you're at it, huh? I think it's cool at it is, and if he makes it slower, then it'll be exellent.
PPS. You're doing great work Geronimo, keep it up.
PPPS. Are you going to, and if yes, then when give us a list of units that will be in the game?
PPPPS. Sorry for bad English if I made mistakes.
PPPPPS. Sorry for so may PS... XD
No that's ridiculous... and I'm just saying that with minor edits it can be more than excellent!
Here's the idea:
1) Ship has taken enough damage, the deathclone starts.
2) Ship slowly starts breaking into pieces because it's weak points (hardpoints in the game) are destroyed - but more, larger pieces.
Not two, it hasn't been split by a powerful laser!
More pieces, because it has taken a severe damage and it's whole superstructure is heavily damaged.
3) Pieces slowly separate from the ship and go in random directions. (of course not random but something that looks like that) I would make bigger parts go down and smaller parts up just for the convenience of viewing the battle without difficulties.
4) After being separated enough pieces fade away.
That is far more convincing because:
a) it's the way games get rid of thrash anyway
b) those parts exploding, have no real reason to do so, they are only to be separated from the ship by far smaller explosion.
c) if there are beasts like Star Destroyers exploding like that in the middle of the battle all over the place, I fail to believe that anything smaller than a Super Star Destroyer would survive a single battle, let alone the whole civil war!
Now imagine how would a deathclone of Eclipse or any other SSD look like following this logic. It would be enough to blow one SSD and whole battle is over, probably the planet's gone as well...
Of all vessels (that didn't self-destruct), only Death Stars blew up in major explosions because their reactor was blown up. There is no way to get near to the reactor of a Star Destroyer so there is no way for it to blow up like that.
Cheers!
Hm... When you put it that way...
Well it's kind of a very good idea. The question is, will Geronimo find time to do the Deathclone again? And more importantly, what to do with the smaller ships then?
And while we're at it i have a suggestion. But at the start I want to say that I never modded any game, so I don't know if it's possible, or time consuming. You (Geronimo), could add a flame to the destroyed hardpoints (even before the entire ship is destroyed) instead of the simple smoke. Something like the Republic at War has implemented. In my opinion it would make the game look not only cooler, but even more realistic.
PS. As always, I'm sorry for any mistakes I made.
Whole deathclone is so unconvincing, IMHO.
If you have a big ship like that, you need the explosion, the cracking, the splitting and everything to look very, very slow - like an ocean cruiser sinking.
You should also get rid of those big blasts at the end.
The ship is crashing because it's weak spots are destroyed not of some reactor overheat or something.
Just make it slower and replace those fireworks blasts with more parts cracking and falling down to the planet's surface and it'll be 100 times better.
Cheers!
And also...
Big boats on the sea split in half because one side sinks, the other side rises and gravity does the rest.
Gravity isn't that strong in space, at all.
It makes a lot more sense* to make it split in more bigger parts than just two surgically cut halves.
* Yeah, I know that Star Wars has its own laws of mechanics concerning movement of ships in space but nevertheless it should look as more convincing as it can.
yes, thats exactly what i want to!!!
it looks so awesome if this massive thing breaks slowly like a big sinking ship... if you saw titanic you know what i mean... or you saw the awesome deathclone of the ISD in the vanilla-game! than you also know what i mean! :D
Boda, feel free to make your own animation with a 10.000 frames duration, me, I prefer to have deathclones that the game can actually handle.
I never ever said longer, I said slower!
It can last as long as your current one but just look more like ISD deathclone in vanilla game but just upgraded to look more realistic.
Just make it look like a magnificent starship crashing not some firecracker suddenly blowing up.
You don't seem to understand my problem with what you're saying, I'll try to point it out a little more clearly:
"Whole deathclone is so unconvincing, IMHO."
"If you have a big ship like that, you need the explosion, the cracking, the splitting and everything to look very, very slow - like an ocean cruiser sinking."
Agreed, that's why I made it so slow. The parts from the superstructure that fly off later are being launched by the explosion in the superstructure.
"The ship is crashing because it's weak spots are destroyed not of some reactor overheat or something."
"Just make it slower and replace those fireworks blasts with more parts cracking and falling down to the planet's surface and it'll be 100 times better."
You just said that there shouldn't be explosions, if there's no explosion why would it crack at all? There's an explosion in the reactor due to heavy damage, this is completely a possible scenario. The ship breaks in 2 as a result of structural integrity failing to hold the ship together against the outward force of the explosion. One part goes up the other goes down, they're pushed away from eachother, as I said, outward force of the explosion. There's no gravity so why should it fall towards the planet, have you seen how far the planet is away from the actual battle?
"Gravity isn't that strong in space, at all."
You just said that the ship should fall downwards towards the center of gravity of a planet, here you contradict yourself again.
"You should also get rid of those big blasts at the end.
The ship is crashing because it's weak spots are destroyed not of some reactor overheat or something."
You did say longer, you don't want the ship to blow up. So am I suppose to completely remove the model all of a sudden? That looks absolutely unrealistic if I suddenly make the model invisible, with timed explosions I make parts of the model go away untill the model is gone completely. I can't keep the ship floating around for 10 minutes because that would cause too much stress on the game.
"It can last as long as your current one but just look more like ISD deathclone in vanilla game but just upgraded to look more realistic."
The vanilla deathclone broke in 2. Mine breaks in 2. There's no gravity in open space so far away from a planet, so I make the ship go all directions so it's more realistic. Vanilla goes down towards a planet which is so far away the gravity isn't strong enough to have an impact on the ship. So I did what you asked for, it looks like vanilla, just much better and more realistic.
"Just make it look like a magnificent starship crashing not some firecracker suddenly blowing up."
Crash into what? There's nothing for it to crash into, the planet is so far away it might aswell be a distant moon, and deathclones that are interactive with the environment do not exist, and cannot exist within this game engine. I have talked about the "firecracker" part a couple of scentences ago.
Honestly I don't understand your point, or what you even want. A more realistic version of vanilla? I did that. Something that breaks into 2 parts? I did that too. It needs to look slow, it is very slow. I find your story a bit unconvincing, IMHO.
"You did say longer, you don't want the ship to blow up. So am I suppose to completely remove the model all of a sudden?"
No, make it fade away.
"That looks absolutely unrealistic if I suddenly make the model invisible,..."
Not really realistic but game-realistic. Makes a lot more sense than all parts blowing up for no reason at all.
It not Mythbusters, it's a SW!
"I can't keep the ship floating around for 10 minutes because that would cause too much stress on the game."
Agreed. That's BS.
"The vanilla deathclone broke in 2. Mine breaks in 2."
Both are bad. Make it brake in a few more bigger parts (less then 10)
"There's no gravity in open space so far away from a planet, so I make the ship go all directions so it's more realistic."
Agreed. That's good. Keep that part.
"Crash into what?"
What do you mean into what? Into nothing, just crash, be destroyed, be obliterated, swiped...
"Honestly I don't understand your point, or what you even want."
Here goes the point, summed up:
1) Ship has taken enough damage, the deathclone starts.
2) Ship slowly starts breaking into pieces because it's weak points (hardpoints in the game) are destroyed - but more, larger pieces.
Not two, it hasn't been split by a powerful laser!
More pieces, because it has taken a severe damage and it's whole superstructure is heavily damaged.
3) Pieces slowly separate from the ship and go in random directions. (of course not random but something that looks like that) I would make bigger parts go down and smaller parts up just for the convenience of viewing the battle without difficulties.
4) After being separated enough pieces fade away.
That is far more convincing because:
a) it's the way games get rid of thrash anyway
b) those parts exploding, have no real reason to do so, they are only to be separated from the ship by far smaller explosion.
c) if there are beasts like Star Destroyers exploding like that in the middle of the battle all over the place, I fail to believe that anything smaller than a Super Star Destroyer would survive a single battle, let alone the whole civil war!
Now imagine how would your deathclone of Eclipse or any other SSD look like following this logic. It would be enough to blow one SSD and whole battle is over, probably the planet's gone as well...
That's my idea. IMHO it's as realistic and as good as it gets on this engine and I think it doesn't require major edits.
Cheers!
"The parts from the superstructure that fly off later are being launched by the explosion in the superstructure."
That doesn't make any sense to me. There aren't any bombs or anything similar planted all over the ship for it to behave that way. And for the same reason all those parts exploding at the end don't make any sense.
"You just said that there shouldn't be explosions..."
Nope, what I said was:
"If you have a big ship like that, you need the explosion, the cracking, the splitting and everything to look very, very slow - like an ocean cruiser sinking.
You should also get rid of those big blasts AT THE END."
I only think that those fireworks at the end should be removed. Some internal explosions must happen.
"The ship breaks in 2 as a result of structural integrity failing to hold the ship together against the outward force of the explosion. One part goes up the other goes down, they're pushed away from eachother, as I said, outward force of the explosion."
Any sane capital ship architect wouldn't make it's base architecture like this:
========== (weakpoint) ==========
========== (weakpoint) ==========
========== (weakpoint) ==========
But more like this (in order to make it more durable):
=== (weakpoint) =================
================= (weakpoint) ===
=== (weakpoint) =================
Now if we assume that Imperial Star Destroyers were constructed by a sane person, while falling apart they won't look like hot butter being sliced.
"There's no gravity so why should it fall towards the planet, have you seen how far the planet is away from the actual battle?"
Actually all parts should go in a random directions. But for viewing convenience I would make bigger parts go down and smaller ones up or something like that. (Just to make it feel random yet not block the view of the battle)
"That doesn't make any sense to me. There aren't any bombs or anything similar planted all over the ship for it to behave that way. And for the same reason all those parts exploding at the end don't make any sense."
If I head into a space shuttle, I'll look around once, in a 360 degree angle, and I'll see atleast 10 systems that'll blow up instantly if I hit it with a turbolaser from the SW universe. This is plain out stupid what you're saying. Now for a star destroyer, I'll name a few:
Life support, O2 storage, powercore, all systems attached directly to the powercore, and those are just 4. There's a lot more that'll explode if you put a few turbolaser shots in it. Something with a high power output like the engines for example.
"I only think that those fireworks at the end should be removed. Some internal explosions must happen."
so you want it to explode, but it can't explode. I explained your contradiction earlier.
"Any sane capital ship architect wouldn't make it's base architecture like this:"
No, any architect would make his ship without weakpoints. The idea of war is to put weakpoints into the enemies ships by shooting at it. Then shoot it some more to make it explode or fall appart. Go figure.
"Actually all parts should go in a random directions. "
Very good, that's what I just told you. Glad you're picking up on things, but I think there's some stuff you really should think about some more, as you wont even use common sense before you wrote that.
"Life support, O2 storage, powercore, all systems attached directly to the powercore, and those are just 4. There's a lot more that'll explode if you put a few turbolaser shots in it. Something with a high power output like the engines for example."
Yeah, yeah, yeah, all those thing blow up but they only produce small explosions, not something as grand as pictured above.
Thing that produce small explosions are just under the coating, things that really blow up (the reactor) are way underneath all the platings.
That's why you can see numberless images of destroyed SDs that are just junk and scrap metal (but not blown up).
"so you want it to explode, but it can't explode."
No!
I want it to be realistically destroyed by taking severe damage and then small explosions from inside slowly rip it apart.
Like I said "if there are beasts like Star Destroyers exploding like that in the middle of the battle all over the place, I fail to believe that anything smaller than a Super Star Destroyer would survive a single battle, let alone the whole civil war!
Now imagine how would your deathclone of Eclipse or any other SSD look like following this logic. It would be enough to blow one SSD and whole battle is over, probably the planet's gone as well..." at small the cost of sacrificing your whole fleet.
"any architect would make his ship without weakpoints."
There isn't a ship without weak points. Every hardpoint you see in the game is a weak point. That's why you need to destroy them in the first place!
Life support would store all kinds of gasses to keep the atmosphere in the ship habitable, parts of those gasses are N2, or H, if this blows it blows up very explosive. A nuclear power plant, well that speaks for itself basically, massive blast. O2, if you've ever seen a compressed O2 tank explode you wouldn't say it's a "small explosion"
The hardpoints in the game are a game mechanic lol, not a weakpoint. If I want to destroy a Nebulon B, I fire at the small section connecting the engine section to the front, not on the only part that actually has some hull integrity, like the front of the ship. The hardpoint system is a game mechanic lol, they're not actual weakpoints of the ship.
You have no idea what you're talking about, please stop spamming, your comments make no sense at all.
I surely will stop commenting because if you really think Star Destroyers explode massively like that, I see no point talking to you any more...
Yes I do think a nuclear reactor gives quite the bang, even if only 1% of the fuel actually blows. Feel free to not believe that though, that's the great thing about science, it works regardless of what you believe.
As I said, feel free to attempt your own deathclone on a star destroyer. Here's the tutorial I used: Petrolution.net
Try it on EJs model, then we'll compare it to mine and we'll settle the argument that way ok?
Here's deathclone done by people far more professional then both you or me:
That basically sums it up.
The ship suffered sever damage from full scale side by side assault. Did it explode? No! We only see small explosions and ship falling because it's too close to the planet. Farther away in space, it would have just stayed there slowly ripping apart by more internal explosions and possibly more enemy fire.
There is no way enemy fire could reach to the ship's reactor core. If there was a way, that Venator wouldn't get that near unless it's skipper is a suicidal maniac who hates not only himself but every clone in about 10 km radius...
Now I will really stop answering your comments because I really see no point in this discussion. You do whatever you want with your mod...
Cheers!
That's a ship crashing into a planet due to...whatever it uses to stay afloat in the atmosphere failing.
This discussion is like one raging on between an atheist and a religious man: It wont amount to anything and nobody will change their minds. Lets quit wasting both our times on it ;)
Exactly what I was saying! :)
Cheers!
I agree, they move a bit fast, but the distance is good. Great effects.
In that portion where the Destroyer splits you should make wires and metal bares hang out from within it.
Looks great. I always thought it was goofy how it split in two because realistically speaking it would take massive amounts of concentrated fire in one section to split it unless there was an internal explosion which still wouldn't make such a clean cut. Seems to me there would be a series of cascading explosions internally separating many pieces of the ship in all directions.
I love the cascading explosions idea, I second this :) perhaps having the pieces break up further as more explosions occur? :)
Rayfire would work well for chunking, after you split up the big pieces. And throw in some different kind of pfx, like electricity around the engines to make it more interesting. Look's good.
Though rayfire looks very interesting indeed, I use max 8, as it works best with windows 7 with the alo plugins, and sadly it's only 9 and up.
Eh. I've never had issues with 9 on 7/8. I ran the 32 bit version. Sometimes it'd take a while to import/export things, but if you didn't click anything while doing it and let it work it's magic, it was fine.
You did great tho i must admit there are two things that could be better.
1# When the ship splits into two pieces it looks like a clean cut and there's barely any fire so it looks like the ship was split in half by some unseen force, my recommendation is to add more fire and maybe some pipes, wires and other stuff on those two parts.
2# The parts fly a bit too fast, make them slower.
Other then that, you did a wonderful job.
Keep up the good work Geroenimo :)
Told you Death clone making isn't that hard. You have to agree this looks a lot better than vanilla death clones.
Also, verry good job!
...
Warb_null kind of has spoken,
all other arguments are invalid now
xD
Thank you, much appreciated.
Very good, but is there a way to make a huge explosion before the parts seperate.
Geroenimo, you have truly outdone yourself this time!
Wow, what a show! Will all of the space models have such awesome deaths?
Very good job. I agree with slowing down the parts that break off. One other thing you might want to consider is the big explosion for the front half of the ship is the same size as the much larger back half. I think it would be cooler if they were a different size of explosion or at least make it so they don't happen at the same time.
Very Good, but when the smallest of the debris break in half the second piece has a high speed.
great job indeed, but how about a second one where the entire ISD goes down like the executor in the Return of the Jedi? after it goes down you make it break in 2 like the normal animation and then it blows up... it would be great :)
Why down, not up? Why not left? And why do you want the exact vanilla deathclone when I built this to be much more complicated thus more interesting? That would be terrible.
hey there's no need to be like that, I said this one was great I was just suggesting something, and besides, I think you got the wrong idea, what I was trying to say is that if you could make the ISD to go down like the executor in this part of RotJ:
but of course, more slowly and without such a high falling degree, and then make it break in 2 like IN YOUR NEW ANIMATION and having the front section of the ISD going up and after that make it blow up like IN YOUR NEW ANIMATION... it would be awesome...
So you're basically asking for the vanilla deathclone, but with the new model. I made this to be much more interesting, unlike vanilla, eye candy.
Also, why down? There's no gravity from the deathstar here, which would cause the ship to go downward? Might aswell go up for that matter. The front of the ship goes up, the back part goes down, as if there's no gravity in my animation, as it should be. It shouldn't go down, like in the vanilla deathclone.
as long as I can remember the vanilla death clone breaks in 2 immediately after it's destroyed, then both parts of the ISD start going down in separate ways... nothing like what I'm suggesting, doesn't matter any more if you can't imagine what I'm talking about it's ok... forget about this post... too bad I can't delete it