Alliance to Restore Canon (ARC)
Fans & Clans
This group is for people who notice canononical contradictions within popular sci-fi and fantasy franchises and wish to discuss them in a safe, TROLL FREE, environment.
Ozzy667 calls everything on this group propaganda. He throws this word around like a chef throwing around pizza dough.
hes essentially like Joseph McCarthy but instead of calling everyone a Communist he accuses EVERYITHING EVER POSTED ON THIS PAGE of being propaganda. if HE doesn't like something he automatically calls it propaganda even if it is the straight truth.
ladies and gentlemen i'll have you know that the pat couple of graphs are posted are accurate. i made them as unbiased as i could, using a plethora of different sources as well as one of Leeland chees personal blogs. granted some of these sources were vague on where exactly certain events fall on the timeline.
so if my graphs are so accurate why does he still claim it as propaganda? well i know the answer to this its because I made them. You see ladies and gentlemen, its not about canon anymore, its not about chronology, its not about good story telling, its not about preserving what was lost, its about attacking Delta. For 4 goddamn years this asshole, ozzy667 and his goons from the Clone wars fans group have been relentlessly attacking me on my profile page as well as some of my other group pages just because i dont believe what they believe in.
hmm does that sound familiar? you don't believe what i believe in therefore your bad and must die? hmm how about the crusades, the holocaust and oh EVERY SINGLE WAR IN THE HISTORY OF HUMANITY.
these degenerate assholes are no better than the over-fanatical Christians in the Westborough Baptist church, the over fanatical muslums killing and terrorizing westerners, or the nazis who killed over 6 million innocent people because they were different.
I assure you if I had not posted those graphs, Ozzy667 would not have made accusations of them being propaganda. Any one of you could have posted those exact same graphs and he would not have had the same reaction. there's your propaganda ozzy happy? (and yes i have snapped, im beyond course with rage)
Muhahahahaha! Who is they? I called you out on your misinformation. You portrayed your ASSUMPTION as Fact and I called you on it. Now everyone gets to see your temper tamprum because you were WRONG.
Be a man and say you made a mistake.
temper tatntrum? im exposing you for who you are.
if somone els had posted those graphs you would have no problem with them. only because i posted them.
and where the hell are your graphs? i dont see you trying to decipher leeland chee's notes.
ive tried being civilized, ive tried being all about "just the facts" and the one time, i finally re-research and compile all of my findings into multiple concise graphs, you still jump all over it, labeling it "prpaganda" or the "stretched truth". after four damn years im tired of it.
theres no pleasing you. perhaps your in denial that there is anything wrong with the timeline at all.
if im sliping into the realm of insanity then it is YOU who is pushing me there. im literally at my wits end
perhaps, its that my graphs contained so much information, that you, unable to find a suitable rebutle, jumped stright to the propagandda claim?
it seems that every time you run out of things to say or cant think of an appropriate response you lable it as propaganda.
Whats this?
Moddb.com
me criticizing the show for throwing another comic out. That's right and I have done it other times too.
I have liked ever clone wars era book, game, show and comic I have seen so far but you have a 100 plus people on this site and to me that means you have a responsibility to give accurate information to fellow fans and when you pass off your assumptions as fact you are doing loyal fans an injustice if they have an interest of knowing when things happened.
Is it stupid to condense the things that they are in to a 2-4 month period. No its stupid as hell but the bright side should be acknowledge too. Hundreds of novels, comics and games will be unaffected because they don't conflict with TCW's new timeline including all the republic commando novels and the game.
And truth be told I did start to make a more accurate graph to correct yours last night. But after starting it I realized I had work to do on the mod and that would just take a lot of time I shouldn't be spending on such endeavors. And before that I started to make a timeline for Regor's group because I thought it would be a cool information piece for fans to know when things happened and also to show other battles they may not know happened because they have not read other clone wars sources but again it was too time consuming
again how is my information inaccurate? i did my research and i made graphs as visual aids. the graphs depicting the previous timeline are spot on accurate. its the ones depicting the new timeline you don't seem to like.
if you think you can compile a better graph using the exact same information i had at hand then be my guest. i listed my sources.
RC being compressed is inaccurate. The novel and comic part is inaccurate because many do not need to be retconned since they do not interfere with the show. Only those that conflict have to be retconned. And of course the part about Everything being compressed is an assumption and most likely inaccurate.
Novels: coruscant nights, ALOT of the republic commando novels by karen travis
Comics: Issues 69 and 70 AKA Dreadnoughts of Rendili. reticoned because it takes place right around the same time as the battle of christophsis. meaning that anakin and obi-wan would be on 2 planets at once. the comics also depict the clones already dawning their phase 2 armor.
Star Wars: Obsession: issues 1,2,3,4 and five. (the entire Boz Pity arc) for obvious resons which, you yourself had allready agreed upon.
and the last few on my list comics regard bariss ofee's death, which you've also acknowledged as being reticonned material
representing them with a dashed line as not to confuse the readers of the graph. it failed obviously because it seems to have confused you
Enlighten me as to how any of the Republic Commando novels will conflict with the show?
As for the rest, that is only about a dozen of the hundreds that exist. I feel it is misleading to represent so much literature with a description that implies most will not fit when in fact most have no conflict.
there are quite a few of her novels that depict life on mandalore that conflict with TCW's depiction of life on mandalore. this effectively caused her to to leave the franchise if you remember correctly.
as for the rest, im still convinced that your being confused by the dashed line effectively labled "reticonned material".
i should have clarified that the dashed lines for comics and novels reticonned materials does not represent the amount of material that had been reticonned. rather it represented the length of some of the reticonned material in relation to where they fell on the previously established timeline. i also had to account for the "unknown" factor. that being the comics and novels that i have not read that may or may not need to be reticonned to to conflictions with TCW. as many in number as my collection of comics may be, believe it or not there are a few that i have not read and as for novels, i haven't read as many of the novels as i have comics.
im starting to think that this whole mess we've found ourselves in is do to my falure to cearify certain things on my graphs. scale is also a problem as a large chunk of the war has been condensed into an area so small that its difficult to draw and represent those events. if you notice on the new timeline graph i did not depict where Galactic Battlegrounds or the Clone Wars game fell on the timeline. thats because, along with alot of other sources, its condensed into that 2 month period and it was concurrent to RC i just could not fit it. if i had drawn it at a larger scale (one that moddb might not even allow) i would have accounted for those events.
other than the length of some reticonned materials, the only thing that is an assumption on the graph is the 2 month condensation. and its not a willy nilly "oh what the hell ill make it 2 months" its an educated estimate. chee never says how many months its condensed into he just says "mere months". seeing that the battle of geonosis takes place towards the end of the year 22bby and cat & mouse takes place that same year, i'd say 2 months is a fairly accurate estimate
it probably wouldnt even have escalated to this if you hadent tossed around my most hated word in your vocabulary, propaganda
I apologize but I had a perfectly logical reason for using the word disinformation because your argument appeared to indicate that you knew your chart included assumptions that were represented in a manner that implied fact which was the very definition of disinformation.
I could have taken a less attacking tone in my first post trying to correct your claim that EVERYTHING would be compiled but your attacking tone toward new canon gets me going sometimes
fair enough. Elements of her novel will have to be retconned.
Now the last thing that bothers me. Why is it you claim wookiepedia as not reliable. Why are you with your limited supply of star wars literature more reliable than the hundreds of contributors who write and edit articles and continously double check each others work for accuracy. Basically you are saying you and your few sources are more reliabel than an entire community of people like you and me.
You do realize that your literature is only written for the time frame it was written and even these guides have probably contradicted previous works as the events in EU are constantly being changed.
Straight from Wookiepedia here is inconsistencies list for The new essential guide to characters
"Due to the fact that this guide was published before Revenge of the Sith was released, it features several inconsistencies about certain characters and events, such as the transformation of Anakin Skywalker into Darth Vader."
Note a first edition to this guide predated it, published in 1995. Since Episode 1 was not written until years after, the clone wars was thought to be an event that happened years before palpatine became emperor and long before he wipes out the jedi.
The new essential guide to Chronology
"Some fans consider the book's in-universe perspective to be an explanation for its various inaccuracies and contradictions."
I am not saying your sources are bogus or anything but it must be stressed that wookiepedia brings these sources and a thousand others in to a massive database that is constantly double checked by contributors as passionate about star wars and canon as we are. To ignore this fact and claim it as a secondary source does not make sense. This does not replace the accomplishment of having personally read all of the sources we can but WE WILL NEVER be able to read all of these sources and compile them accurately including retcons without a database like wookiepedia.
i used the new essential guide to chronology to construct the graphs depicting the previously established timeline. i did not use that source for the graphs depicting the new timeline.
also if you read my sources on the graphs you'll find that i did use wookeepidea only as a secondary source. does this mean that i did not use wookieepedia at all, i used it for things not covered by chee's blog or the essential guide to warfare. the main thing i went off of was Leland Chee's blog and the essential guide to warfare that you gave me a copy of months ago.
at times wookieepedia can be reliable, however i found it to be pretty biased sometimes. for example: a few months ago i was reading the article on the clone wars miniseries and i noticed that it did not list the awards that it had won in 2005 and 2006. i know for a fact that it won an Annie award in 2006 as well as 2 small emmies for "oustanding animated production" in 2004 and 2005 from reading on of Steve Sansweet's books. needless to say, I and other fellow wookieepedia contributors fixed it and now the article has a less negative ton towards the miniseries as it previously did.
one major way to tell if a wokieepedia article is good is if the article has a neutral tone. if the article has an over negative or over positive tone i would not recommend using it as a primary sorurce. this however doesnt mean you couldn't pick out some good info from an over positive/negative source but generally tr not to take to much from it. remember as long as you add some sort of source when you edit an article, anyone can edit a wookieepedia article.
Alrighty then