Version 1.88.71 Feedback Thread - Ultimate Apocalypse Mod (DOW SS) for Dawn of War

Please state all possible or definite bugs that needs to be fixed in the next version.

This thread relates to the THB 1.88.71 release. All later versions will be posted on other threads.

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There will be NO "I am missing Tyranids, Daemons or IDH race" reports. I will simply delete your post if this happens. Make sure that you have actually loaded The UA THB: New Factions mod in the game manager if you wish to use these races. Also make sure all separate race mods are up to date!

Eldar vehicles do not gain a shield when the holo-fields research is complete.

Eldar corsairs do not have a jump ability. Description says they can vault over impassable terrain.

DE Ancient Websail lower section has a pink texture.

Whenever i equip my SM terminators with plasma cannons their unit potrait turns into a pink box. Same goes for CSM terminators equipped with lightning claws.

Scouts silenced bolters when firing create constant beeping sounds.

Big Mek can't teleport with ANY attached squad, even though his description says he can. Weirdboy on the other hand can, except with mega armored nobz.

Repost cuz Khoran_Gutsplitter said so. (And you don't want to upset Khorne

Bug report.
Scout marine new weapon the Silent Bolter sound is a weird
It make the weird sound when something is not working properly

Question. about the IG commander unit Colonel

How do you use him effectively ?. The only thing I see him do good is I full squad him with Banner's or Ogryn

Not quite a bug but windows defender is auto-deleting the installer every time I extract the mod. I've tried both download sources (moddb and mediafire) to no avail.

Heya! I have been playing this mod for a good bit, alas I’ve noticed something was off, unless it’s just my installation of the mod had gone somewhat wrong, whenever I upgrade my imperial guard turrets to heavily fortified, usually there should be punisher cannons, but for some reason they don’t appear at all, and thus it leaves me devastated in skirmishes as I have to panic and make what I can to combat vehicles, is this a new bug?

Also, is it just me or are the Dark Eldar unusually dangerous now, they seem to be capable of shooting out tons of troops, the AI at least at an alarming rate, it does get me quickly wiped out when I play my Space Marines, anyone else having that issue?

DoW Mod Manager does't see mod. I tried to re-install it. It didn't help.

Game crashes after 10 minutes of a game 4*4 with AI. 4Gb patch is activated. Launched as UltimateApocalypse_THB

Asuswebstorage.com damps of crashes. Use IE to open the link.

Edited by: Inqizitor

First of all great work, and thank you for this awesome mod

To my Bug (?):

-CTD after about 15 mins ingame
-7 times now, was not able to finish a single game
-Using the DvD Verson of the Game up to now (activated it on steam some minutes ago, and will reinstall the mod on that version, just to check)
-happened with 1.0 and 1.2 versions of SS
-8 player game, 7 AI
-Every game i used the IG, enemy teams contained of every other race [except tau, (i remember them spawning titans even if disabled), Tyrannids or Daemons (since im aware of some bugs in the past which caused the game to CTD)]
-Different Team comps from 3v5 to 2v2v4 or free for all
-Commander Gear is disabled (some bug with the Tyrannid AI in the past?)

-4GB patch active


Some Specs:
GTX 670
i5 4440
8gb RAM

Res 1902x1080, 32-bit
Tried different textures from high to low, no dif

Edited Post: Originally I had a problem and submitted it as feedback but realized 1.88.71 was released, which fixed all problems. Whoops, sorry about this!

Edited by: DuelsidedHeart

Salcol's won't launch, the button is greyed out due to the mod manager looking for objective_points_ss_ua, THB looks for objective_points_ua (no ss) How to fix this?

Just finished a skirmish, the Sisters of battle have a few issues, Ill try to remember all the ones I saw.

-They have a vehicle that is labled and described as the Taurox, but is not. It's the vehicle that looks like a demon in a jar on treads.

-When trying to build the archangel I got a popup saying I dont have enough ork resource.

-Relic resource was saying it was at +12, but was staying at zero. I didn't have any relics so it's just a display issue.

-Some building descriptions seem to have the faith and relic point cost icons mixed up. If I play tomorrow Ill be more specific

Also earlier I was trying to play with 5 other friends and each time we tried to start the game at least one of us would not be able to load in correctly and would be dropped from the game. The person that failed to load in would be random each time.

Also having crash after 15 min of gameplay with 3v3. 4 GB patch was applied in Soulstorm.exe and GraphicsConfig.exe

My rig is core i7 97

32gb ram

gpu rtx 2080

Edited by: JulioBantim

Run ability bugged for AI

The AI seems to be able to spam the run ability. Just played a game as space marines against chaos space marines and all of their units run insanely fast, assault marines couldn't catch any of them. They kite the hell out of any of my melee units. Even with ranged units I can't finish them off, they simply run away.

The chaos dreadnought can also run.

Posted these in the wrong thread...

Scout marines silenced bolter sounds are broken as has been reported by multiple people already.

Force Commander (using Space Marine (general) chapter option) becomes unrecruitable once you upgrade command units to terminator armor. Is this intended?

EDIT: This is casued by the research requirements of the terminator armor force commander: It requires the ultra marines chapter research (which, for whatever eason, has been removed) and actually gets disabled when you research the blood ravens (or 'general space marines', as they are now called in-game):

space_marine_squad_force_commander_terminator.rgd ->

research\\marine_chapter_bloodravens_research.lua -> ["research_must_not_be_complete"] = true research\\marine_chapter_ultramarines_research.lua" -> ["research_must_not_be_complete"] = false

Which means in the current version of the mod you can't actually build the the terminator armor force commander - the only way to get him is if you recruit the normal force commander and then research the armor upgrade, but once he's dead he's gone for good (since you can't build the normal force commander either).

On a related note, is it intended that you can recruit BOTH the force commander and the brother captain, but you can only recruit EITHER the terminator armor force commander (if you recruit the force commander and upgrade him) OR the chapter master?

Edited by: Viper_86

I have only noticed one bug so far during this update.

Space marine predator tanks and dreadnaughts have a missing texture and appear as small pink boxes in the game.

Eldar:
=====
The Eldar are pure annoyance to play as and against. Early on they got these 3, pretty similar ranged infantry units (the ones costing 15 req to reinforce and are built at the HQ, later also Corsairs and then the Dire Defenders). All of them are pretty similar and I don't really get what their distinct roles should be as range, weaponry, squad menu upgrade choices are pretty similar. I get it that each infantry type has it's own upgrade path aside from the generic +damage and +health upgrades, still I don't *feel* that there's anything justifying to have 3 so similar ranged unit types. And the only thing I noticed Dire Defenders are good at is throwing grenades faster than other infantry. According to ingame text they should also be good against vehicles after an upgrade but that's a section already covered by the melee infantry built at the HQ that only costs 15 req to reinforce and can be outfitted with anti vehicle weaponry (ranged).

What makes the Eldar annoying to play is that they, story-wise, are about speed, illusion, traps etc. but that's already covered by the Dark Eldar (+fear) and the Tau. As they lack tanky units early on they've received shields and selfrepair on their vehicles and tons upon tons of buff effects and special stuff to the point where I'd say: That's too much ! I really don't want to run around with the Farseer and Dark Seer (? unsure of name currently), spamming their special abilities just because it's so damn efficient.

Economically they're also annoying with their req <-> energy income transfer toggle as that has to be done per Webway structure, resulting in micromanagement all over the map. And that toggle provides the player using it with a resource plus still even if the other resource already hit +0 production value, so there would actually be something to transfer anymore to generate the other type of resource, yet the other type of resource still receives the bonus. That can be easily exploited for mass resource production.

Their Scoprions, the sole strong melee unit, is morale broken easily. Couldn't test Harlequins yet to compare those to them.
The snipers are mediocre always. Too few per squad to fight infantry hordes - the only type of enemy they're actually good against, too little range compared to many other sniper units so that they lose vs those if spotted, the slow on enemy targets doesn't stack in duration or strength on continuous attacks, making it mediocre and against hero units they're also mediocre but not good either. They should get +1 squad member or slightly more damage via their stealth research, a leader unit that buffs the suqad's damage and increases it's sight range (currently sight is smaller than weapon range) and an upgrade at tier 3 at least that makes them more effective against heavy infantry, considering they're useless against vehicles and structures and not that good against commanders / heroes / special infantry units either but just mediocre.

There seems to be an issue with the visibiltiy of enemy Eldar structures, sometimes flickering from visibility to invisibility while in range of a long-range detector unit or structure. I guess it may have to do with the Webway upgrade that is supposed to reduce keen sight on enemy units.

Edit: Eldar structures relocate very slow. If could relocate as fast as in the campaign then the Eldar would have their mobile bases as in the campaign. Combined with their construction unit's teleportation ability this could make some nice flanking ability but also good hit & run.

Space Marines:
=============
Huge power and requisition issues. It shifts. Early on requisition is rare as Space Marine combat units are pretty expensive, then power due to vehicles and upgrades draining it (by my impression more so than for other factions), then it's requisition again, unless you're trying to build defenses that cost a lot.

2 issues with the Scouts:
1) their leader unit construction order is on the button [Q] - same as the order for "Run !" and that's a button conflict
2) the new "Silenced Tactical Bolter" makes weird, electronical click-bug sounding noises and I guess the wrong wound file was used there; it's pretty nerve-wrecking having to listen to that

Also the Scout's sniper rifles are too bad. Medium at morale breaking, somewhat useful in terms of damage, overall same issue as with the Eldar's snipers: Even multiple Scout squads, all outfitted with sniper weapons, struggle to compete with fewer heavy infantry in terms of damage and morale effect, even when just used as fire support unit they're not that much noticeable later on. Tier 3 upgrade for more effect against heavy infantry desired.

BUG: The Scouts' explosive charges can't be detonated with their abiltiy for that reliably. It doesn't work as it should.

Their Stalker AA tank isn't worth buying. It's so bad against aircraft, in firepower, range and survivability, that I've totally stopped using that unit. According to text it can drop minefields faster than the other 2 transport units but why it got that ability or how that should help it perform it's AA role is a mystery to me.

ISSUE(?): Sternguard Veterans (ranged elite) can't purchase some weapons more than once instead of 6 times after all the researches (Multi-Melta, Plasma Cannon, Twin-Linked Lascannon).

Dreadnaught Walkers:
Having 4 of them is too much. They're still good at reducing enemy morale in melee combat but they're too weak and vulnerable now, especially in ranged combat and despite correct weaponry. Rather 2 useful ones (range / melee) or multiple upgrades than a bunch of 4 same-ish that all feel far weaker than the sole version from Dawn of War GOTY version. Seriously: Take a look how long it takes one to take out some targets their weaponry is supposed to be good against (in my case I noticed that vs Chaos Marines). There's more than a minute spent on a single unit when only using the ranged fire mode. Feels like attacking with a scout pistol. In Dawn of War GOTY the same weapon shredded through Orc infantry reliably. Feels very off.

Edit:
Noticed that the Space Marine's purely ranged Dreadbaught stops attacking structures with it's bolter additioally to the missile launcher but instead only uses the missile launcher. The 2 ranged upgrades also seem to malfunction with the spot they're attached to and the attack animation spot used.

Imperial Army:
=============
Tank Command:
Forgot the name of the tank with the description "exchanges accuracy for more damage" - this one tank totally lacks a niche. I've tried to put it at good use multiple times anywhere but other tanks always outperformed it. Could be made good against monstrous creatures and slow unit around the one being hit. That'd give it a niche.

For the specialized Leman Russ tanks it'd be nice to get a tooltip info what their secondary main- and side weapons are. Most start with bolters but some with flamers. Add main- and side weapon information to these tanks too please and to what these can be upgraded (if even).

The Demolisher tank is vastly overpowered: huge range, high damage vs structures, medium damage vs vehicles, area damage vs infantry +slow +morale reduction, never misses and can attack aircraft (!). This beast is currently good vs everything, more or less, but mostly. Of the Tank Command tanks only the Vanguard and Punisher should be able to attack aircraft, not every other tank, aside from with side guns. Imperial Guard has these, the Medusa tank and their own air units aside from infantry and defenses to engage aircraft. That's good enough.

The Punisher tank doesn't do well enough vs infantry which is it's niche. Many other Tank Command tanks do similarly well while being good vs other unit types to and some of them even apply additional effects. I'd suggest buffing the Punisher's damage bonus vs infantry and heavy infantry (all weapons on that unit). It could also get a niche of a stacking armor penetration debuff the longer it attacks an enemy unit so that it could be a useful armor reduction debuff stacking unit vs other super units that are usually hard to kill. The flamer side guns weapon upgrade should deliver less damage per single unit but focus on area damage and morale effect (and also receive some bonus vs demons / monstrous creatures).

The default Leman Russ tank should receive a vehicle cost decrease from 4 (same as any of the specialized Leman Russ patterns) to 3, as that tank doesn't have any nerve gas launchers and can't get any specialized upgrades either. The default Leman Russ tank doesn't perform too well vs vehicles and structures and is easily countered by anti vehicle weapons.

The Chimera tank (light version, without cannon) should have it's vehicle support cap reduced from 2 to 1 because that's what the light transports of other factions cost. The light version of the Chimera lacks an armor upgrade and so pretty fast becomes a paper tank. Luckily it has a lot of flamers on it to drop enemy morale fast and due to that has some survivability vs morale effected infantry that doesn't do a lot of damage until morale is dropped. It's bolter weapon upgrade needs a buff: I'm paying money to replace an area effect, morale dropping, useful vs structures, never missing flamer for a single-target-only anti-infanty-only, not-morale-dropping bolter that doesn't really perform well (low damage, medium range). That bolter should be better vs infantry and heavy infantry than it is now - I'm using it on a paper tank and dropped my morale reducing flamer for it ! Eventually this bolter could also drop enemy morale a bit more than regular bolters.

Guardsmen Riders could use either a rally command on their squad leader after researching a tech tier or reseaching a +morale technology; alternatively a new squad member, available at tier 2, carrying a flag for +morale and +morale healing would help (only has generic Guardsmen rider ranged attack to not block others in melee combat). They're really only good for short combat as their morale regeneration is bad. I'd prefer a rider with a flag as described, available after some of the +morale researches. Also eventually at tier 4 adding explosives to their special abilities would give them huge harass potential. Alternatively sniper / melta setups would also work as they can be positioned nicely and are meant to harass.

Sentinel:
That unit should be constructible without installing a depot for it first. It's one of the iconic key units of the Imperial Army and not being able to build it right from the start just feels odd. The keen sight of the unit should be the same as after it's sensor upgrade initially and the sensor upgrade should double that as the Sentinel is a scout / harass unit by definition. This unit also has a lot of confusing weapon choices: Many being labeled as anti vehicle / anti structure but only one being labeled as anti infantry. It's not clear what to use in which situation and how. Basically I need 3 different setups:
1) infantry & listening post / turret structures (early game harass)
2) vehicle & all structures (fire support; bad against (heavy) infantry)
3) infantry, heavy infantry, special infantry, infantry heroes (fire support vs infantry as well as find & kill vs infantry)
What I currently get are weird weapons that all don't perform too well, a lot of thing I need to research (depot, sensors, armor) and the unit still not performing all too well after that. The only thing that feels right for the unit currently is that it's vulnerable but the harass / fire support role lacks.

I like the concept of having upgraded versions of the intitial weapon role choices available early on. What I don't like is that I have to kill my unit and rebuild another, because unlike the Leman Russ tanks I can't just upgrade and existing weapon to it's successor that improves the unit.

Sandbag infantry dudes (the ones costing 1 population): There's a bug with them, making them not benefit from the armor upgrades when toggling between sandbag mode and back. So it's as if they're lackign upgrades, making them easy to kill.

Comissar Cadets: They reinforce too slow, are too expensive to reinforce, are affected by generic unit knockback, making them fail to attack other races' melee infantry, their damage is bad, even with a Priest attached to the squad and all melee damage upgrades researched, they have no special abilities (aside from execute via Comissar) and o grenades either. They are so bad that I stopped using them. Must have: faster and cheaper to reinforce. Nice to have: a basic ranged damage protection buff (1 shield icon of 2 possible ones), knockback immunity vs knockback of other races' infantry so that they can actually fight them instead of failing at that, a squad-adjusted (in health, combat values) medic as squad menu purchase option - as melee units are among the hardest hit units, at least 1 secondary effect - either stun or slow, eventually after the power fists research. Also when talking about zeal etc. this should be THIS unit's special but it doesn't get any value improved while in combat and also lacks a leader that improves the squad's health and damage as the Comissar only applies his generic Comissar buffs - so the squad overall either needs to adjust for that with overall buffed values and the Comissar kept the same or the Comissar should additionally provide the buffs a squad leader would provide. Also curious if 2 Comissars in the squad would actually mean that the passive regeneration bonus stacks or not.

Earthshaker Platform:
EMP should only target vehicles and structures, if that's a possible thing.
The range of stationary structures should always be higher than the range of mobile units of the same or lower tech tier or size. The range of the platforms is too low. I get it that high range would make it easy to effortlessly deal with enemy bases and unit concentrations so perhaps multiple +range upgrades per individual unit could be added so that the platform CAN have more range than the mobile units but it'll cost time and resources, making it a strategic choice. It'd also be nice if there's be a button to toggle off ALL earthshaker platforms' attacks as their siege damage also hits own and allied units close by and while squads can easily be mass-selected the same is not possible for structures.

Comissars:
Execute should be usable once a Comissar is attached to a squad and not only after tier1 has been researched. Otherwise there's no reason to actually attach a Comissar to a squad prior to that, when it's better to use him to melee tank the enemies instead while the squad deals ranged damage.

Psykers:
Cast animations too long, everything else mediocre, affected by knockback. Due to all of that often dies after a single use of special abilities or before that. Could use some editing. It's pointless having a caster unit that's easily killed by most other units, affected by knockback AND has long cast animations. Could also use an upgrade at tier 4 that overall buffs all values a bit and reduces cooldowns as otherwise Comissars and Priests are the superior choice.

Vox Operators:
I don't really get it what value they should add for ground units. Their air attack requests don't improve with the tech tiers and researches - neither in power nor in frequency they're possible, they're actually somewhat strong melee combat units instead of ranged combat units and their squad bonus doesn't actually help the squad a whole lot with it's own combat role but instead refers to air units (?).
Btw. Communication Tower air strikes should scale with tech tiers anyway as they cost resources.

Explosives (dropable by infantry squads):
For larger squads the range of the action needs to be increased as otherwise the special ability is both a risk (as the whole squad is in explosion radius upon using this) and not worth the damage (forcing the whole squad to move, causing more damage drop than a damage plus of the explosives would grant). So as squad sizes increase the range for size should perhaps too - or right from the start be buffed.

Gunship:
Vehicle support cap cost far too high compared to usefulness, attack animation bug.

Marauder Bomber:
BUG: After dropping bombs it sometimes happens that this special ability is getting "stuck" in it's recharge cycle and won't recharge anymore ever.

Baneblade tanks:
Firesword is supposed to be good against infantry, morale, demons but does "okay" instead of well against those doesn't actually stand out against demons. Due to being a flame weapon the vehicle should actually also be good vs light structures. The Stormlord is supposed to be superior vs infantry, heavy infantry and morale but in reality is "good" instead of "superior", despite being a niche tank. The weird thing about the Stormlord is that it's also supposed to be a transport but it's main weapon doesn't work while moving, that it needs to face the enemy it's attacking and that it's dropped in via cargo ship into combat instead of being built at the player's base, granting the opportunity of loading units in there (which is also rarely required as other drop actions exist except when talking about vehicles). Stormblade and Stormsword have issues with melee units attacking them.

The new support truck that was added with this update:
This is just one support unit too much. The IG already has 2 Chimera types and 2 infantry hero units of which 1 can supply them with infantry units. Just one more unit doing the same isn't actually helpful but unit clutter. It'd be more helpful if the light Chimera transport would've received these upgrades to make that unit more useful as currently I've always built the Kronos pattern of it instead due to being pretty much the same but with more health and better punching. I'd like to see this new unit removed and it's upgrades being transfered to the light Chimera instead to keep this unit useful later on. It's also a fast unit transport already.

Currently Warhammer style unit spam isn't possible for the IG as it lacks proper unit setups. Instead of being able to construct a fully outfitted squad to send directly against the enemy it's always necessary to train a leader in the HQ to attach to the squad, add further infantry via squad buy menu to the squad, reinforce the squad until at max, then buy it's weapons and only then the squad is ready to be sent against the enemy. There's unit management involved as if the IG were Space Marines.
Ideally, as the IG mobilizes (proceeds through the tech tiers), squads should be created with more members already reinforced up to the point of reinforcing squads after training them is no longer necessary as they're already maxed out, all types of squad leaders (Comissar / Priest / Psyker/ Vox Operator) would be available from the squads' weapon buy menu instead of having to train them at the HQ, then transfer to the squads to attach them to them, secondary support units would passively be added with the tech tiers or via research (medic, flag carrier) and the tech tiers would also allow to outfit more and more squad members with proper weaponry while keeping the units themselves squishy (aside from some basic health upgrades).
-----

Flag carrier units of all factions:
Very low health, bad regeneration, nearly non-existing damage. I can life with the poor damage but that unit should STAND. Also +morale isn't the thing helping all to much and that I want of that unit but also that it *increases* morale regeneration of the squad it's attached to considerably ! It doesn't help that this unit shares a limited-unit-pool with all the other special squad-attachable units either. Either make this unit a more useful choice or take it off the shared squad-attachable unit limit.
Edit: In case flag carriers already improve morale regeneration rate this belongs in the tooltip too instead of not being mentioned.

For all units, structures, special effects, upgrades:
If anything has or adds a special effect please add that to the tooltips ! If something does area of effect damage, if area of affect damage does only affect the enemies instead of all units, if something has knockback, EMP, disables abilities, blinds, stuns, ignores terrain etc. That's all worth putting into the unit / upgrade / special ability tooltip !
Same for units that are immune to knockback etc. -> info in tooltip pls.

Global issue with transportation:
Trying to get units inside transport units sometimes becomes problematic and micromanagement as the units often won't enter their transport at all unless being maneuvered very close, by hand, to a specific spot near the unit from which they can enter it. Can anything be done about this for reliability of transports ?

Weapon upgrades:
It'd be nice to get an information in the tooltip which weapon is replaced by the one offered by the upgrade or whether there's installed an additional weapon on an empty spot. Most often it's obvious, sometimes not.

Edited by: UsernameUsernameRev

Still having crashes after 15 min of gameplay with 3v3 and 4v4. 4 GB patch was applied in Soulstorm.exe and GraphicsConfig.exe

Sisters of Battle:
They have a lot of special abilities that they only receive when a Monk is attached to their squad, which is issue #1: lack of actual choices what to add to a squad, as the Monk provides the most well rounded bonusses.

Issue#2 with the Sisters of Battle is that a lot of their special abilities aren't situational or limited enough and can be spammed a whole lot. So it's the player's job to click through squads and spam all the special buttons when they're ready for maximum buffs. The damage pushback spell that redirects a part of the damage received back to attackers shouldn't affect structures as it makes attacking with already anti structure / anti vehicle based units easier than with any other faction, as regular defender along with stationary defensive structures basically damage themselves by attacking the enemy.

There's also a bug with the initial Sisters of Battle squad, available at the lowest tech level: When upgrading their weapons to those new bolters that still lack a caption and then using the skill that changes their damage to holy damage their weapon types glitch.

In general the Sisters of Battle have a faith issue: Either piles up or they have none. It's never really tactical. Either too little or spam all you can from a large faith resource pool.

Space Marines:
Scouts lack sight range. Their sight is around 66% that what their sniper rifles cover in range at the final upgrade stage. At least when having a skull probe attached to their squad their sight range should increase considerably - and for scouts it should be higher compared to the sight range of regular combat units anyway and that right from the start (or at least via tech researches).

The Scouts have bolters and silenced bolters as upgrade choices. It'd make more sense to require bolters to be able to upgrade them to silenced bolters, available once Scout stealth has been researched, instead of having 2 nearly identical bolter choices, with one being plain better - unless that's a thing not possible for infantry but only for vehicles.

Thinking about it: It would be beneficial for the Scouts to start with sniper rifles and get upgrade choices for the other weapon types that are either medium (bolter) or close range (shotgun). Same for the Imperial Guard and their Special Weapons team. Because the shotgun is far more of a threat than the sniper rifle that one should actually be up for research. Outperforms the bolter too in kill potential, due to area damage. I think that would be the better swap. Short range pistols rather as weapon toggle option (if possible) than as actual initial weapon.

Imperial Guard:
The General's squad units should get kickback immunity from other units in melee combat, along with the General himself (should be a standard for all faction leaders and their squad units). Explosions may still affect. Just let the unit (and the squad) be good at the only thing they're supposed to to: melee combat. On a side note: Some hero abilities could improve later on via researches throughout the tech tree as some of the special attacks / special skills aren't all that great later on and feel like they're not worth the effort then.

There's a bug with the 2 infantry heroes that can be trained at the Infantry Command: Loading any of them into a transport removes their buffs (test it with the population cap) - was a bug on my list from the previous UA version, haven't checked it for this one yet.

Edit:
I've also got a question regarding Necrons: They've got 2 technology choices once the Forbidden Archive is finished and a relic has been captured that affect build speed. One if for Builder Scarabs directly and one influences the time in which things are done. The description of that is a little bit unclear to me. Is this correctly understood:
-the Scarab tech choice for 300 energy at the amplification generator directly buffs the Scarab's build speed by +1% per Amplification generator and otherwise has no limit
-the time-in-which-things-are-done choice that costs 1000 energy is capped at 100% efficiency and becomes completely useless once 10 points have been captured with Obelisks built on them
?

And the "Global Amplification" bonus states that each generator will apply less of a bonus with no description how that works and whether there's a certain limit at which no further bonus will be granted and how that interacts with living metal units on the field.

Squad reinforcement bug (discovered while playing as Space Marines): Attach a Skull Probe to any squad and select that one for the transport's reinforce ability and you're able to reinforce squads that weren't meant to be reinforceable, like Terminator squads (works on other races for all their possible attacheable leader units too). While all other squad units aren't selectible for the reinforce ability the Skull Probe is. This should be checked for all factions' attacheable leader units: Can they be targeted by the reinforce ability, making it possible to bloat squads sizes ?

Space Marines:
Melee Terminator squads should be looked at - they don't work:
-they have no ranged defense and thus die really fast as they're primarily heavy infantry with just a lot of health but no defense
-they lose morale pretty fast, making this powerful unit with mobility issues useless often in combat
-even when they have their targets nothing stops them from repositioning while the Terminator squads just can't catch up well

I feel like this squad doesn't even work for combat unless a Standard Bearer is attached to it. If doing so this unit is the weakest unit of the squad and takes part in melee combat. When I then order such a squad to move somewhere the Standard Bearer runs ahead, leaving the rest of the slow Terminators behind to catch up later - doesn't work well. I suggest a major overhaul for the melee Terminators to make them actually work:
-no more leader units attacheable, as nothing works for the very slow, lots of damage taking melee Terminators but everything dies fast and doesn't really help or doesn't work with the slow unit movement
-either no more morale (=morale immune) or a squad menu added Standard Bearer as Terminator version that helps regenerating morale faster while alive
-the squad urgently needs at least some ranged damage reduction and for that a squad menu added Terminator unit with a shield would help, providing +1 of 2 blue shield icons while alive to reduce all ranged damage the squad takes, as well as providing it with at least a smoke grenade, adding another +1 blue shield icon

A big issue is still their bad mobility with no option to force the enemy to stay in combat. So even if morale doesn't drop to 0 and they are teleported into combat, elimination the initial movement and damge taking issue, the enemy can just reposition. Enemies aren't slowed or stunned as that slow unit would need it to at least deal with the enemies they already made contact with. This somehow ruins the whole concept of the unit. It's powerful but just doesn't work. Also the melee Terminators don't deal any good melee area damage, making them worse vs hordes of infantry than their ranged version, even if equipped with weapons specifically against infantry - they can never outperform the ranged Terminators, even under best conditions, in melee combat vs infantry.

Currently the melee Terminators are merely structure demolishers and face tanks, without any great defense, that need to be teleport into battle because of their mobility issues.

Edit: I'm an idiot - just noticed you can already add a Standard Bearer to the Terminator squad but have to decide whether to add a leader (desecription doesn't say if that one even adds any health and/or damage to squad members?) or an Apothecary (obviously required...). That's not really a choice. I need an Apothecary because melee Terminators are obviously taking a lot of damage and I need a Standard Bearer for the Terminators to be able to keep the morale up. Please add a description what the squad leader provides, if anything besides "Rally" to restore morale once upon clicking it (and with a very high cooldown even on Terminators).
Just tested the Terminator's Standard Bearer - dies too fast still. But at least I could confirm that Standard Bearer DO increase morale regeneration while alive. Should really be part of their tooltip as that's far more important than merely adding some morale on top.

Ranged Terminators:
Seems like the 3rd weapon upgrade doesn't work on them that'd allow them to carry 6 ranged weapons of choice: They're only able to use 4.

Skull Probes:
Could it be that they're unable to detect infiltrated units at any meaningfull range ? At least the Skull Probe attached to the Scout Squad is almost at keen sight range +8m.

Could someone check whether Devastator Marines benefit from all weapon upgrades ? Their damage seems lower than it should be.

Edited by: UsernameUsernameRev

Hello, I'm having a problem and don't know if only happening to me. While play with IG when upgrade the Heavy Bolter Turret to Punisher Cannon this doesn't change to the Punisher Cannon, it still being Heavy Bolter Cannon; also when I upgrade to Vanquisher Cannon appear Missile Turret. Can you tell me if only happen to me or it's a bug. Thanks a lot for attention. Greetings.

Keen sight seems overall reduced to perhaps (crippling) degrees. This lets factions with survivable and high dps stealth units really bully enemy gun-lines by forcing unit charges. Otherwise you get picked apart by the stealth unit, or the units firing beyond LOS.

To a certain degree, this is working as intended, but there seems to be no realistic or micro-managed counter that is cost effective. The IG HQ ping is great, but the ones costing 100P are a huge tax, leaving some factions really out in the cold.

Necrons - Attack Scarabs:
The Necrons usually have issues repairing their vehicles because Builder Scarabs are needed for construction first before anything else. Starting to repair things with these most often is a wrong decision even if it costs a vehicle as the flow of energy and the ongoing tech race is far more important. So how about granting Attack Scarabs the ability to repair things ? They're fast, mobile, can be replenished easily and lack options in lategame. Perfect role to add repair capabilites, imo.

Edit:
Idea mostly based on the fact that Necron infantry can rezz nearly without any limit, given the right circumstances, while vehicles always need to retreat for lengthy repairs.

How about a slightly different concept for the Imperial Guard:
Each tech tier doesn't increase each squad's soldier limit by +1 but instead allows to add +1 leader unit more to each squad:
-"leader unit" means any unit attachable to squads but instead purchaseable from the squad's weapon buy menu as extra unit
-the idea is to have leader units as buy option from each squad's reinforce menu
-the type of leader should still be restricted by the current tech tier and HQ upgrades

Leader units would help squads to stay alive longer due to their own health and active- as well as passive abilities, while also enhancing the squads' performance in general by allowing them to react to more and more variety in combat situations with each different type of leader unit added. I feel the IG needs that as their infantry can't compete in late game due to a lack of survivability.

Each tech tier should also decrease unit prices while speeding up their reinforce-, leader buy- and weapon buy speed for each squad and that not linear but stronger in effect the higher the tech tier. While the IG is meant to spam infantry waves it can't really do that as they neither have significantly cheaper units nor faster training & upgrading ones. In fact the opposite is true by struggling with the leader choices and -limits. If needed the morale researches could still add +1 infantry squad cap per research and tech tier in combination.

The squad weapons themselves should also get a critical look as they lack a proper niche. Plasma Pisols are nice vs almost everything so the the Meltas and Flamers aren't that interesting and sniper rifles in general have too little range, damage and too long reload time to be worth a seperate research. But in general I'd like seperate researches for each of these weapon types to allow more flamers than any of the other weapons, for example, as the IG flamers are only light versions so more are needed to achieve the same effect and squads can't fully equip flamers with all soldiers currently. And for Meltas that would be an upgrade that increases their range, rate of fire and damage a bit to make up for their inability to deal with heavy infantry and be better vs their intended targets than the Plasma Pistol.

Another noticed issue is the IG's stationary infantry guys that can easily be disrupted in 4 ways:
-morale breaking
-melee combat
-knockback
-blinding

I'd like to see 3 types of researches for them:
-a "Full Scale War" research (or once that tier has been researched) that allows them to get ready to fire much faster after movement / knockback / end of melee combat
-an extra range upgrade at the next tier
-passive stealth, at least while stationary, at the tier after that one
And in any case the damage vs infantry needs to continue to increase per tech tier as these deal no area damage and neither do they slow down, armor reduce or morale cripple attacking enemy infantry so later on they fail to supply the required support fire, except for vehicles, but that could also use a little buff (only for the last 2 tiers). Especially vs infantry these are currently not good enough - but only at the last 2 tiers, where they noticeably lack the ability to hold the enemy off.

Another thing is the IG's garrison special and their intended trench wars role. They got no bunkers for infantry to construct from which they can use their actual squad weapons, the garrison feature can't be upgraded for lategame to either get more range & damage or allow squads to use their actual weapons and trenches can't be constructed but only tank traps and walls. And structures can't be reinforced either - neither in hitpoints (not even any installed depots increase structure hitpoints), nor to allow more garrisoned units inside nor with additional systems installed in or on them to improve them.

Further IG:
When using the Leman Russ Inferno Tank's "Let it burn" ability the tank's model switches to another one for a short time.

Baneblade tanks:
Shadowsword Titanicus:
The tooltip before unit production doesn't state that this unit has a special attack that costs 2000 power to fire. The tooltip of the ability on the unit itself also lacks an information about the cooldown that special ability has and whether that special ability is just an extra shot equal to the regular shot in strength or superior. When using this special attack the game also shows an area indicator that is far larger than the actual area affected. It would be nice to get a reload indicator on that unit, as it's reload time is quite long and each shot counts, as well as a ground target order, as the unit sometimes refuses to attack an assigned target unless made to face it in advance, which isn't an issue if a ground target order is given (artillery has the same issue sometimes and that ground target order fixes the issue as it forces the unit to attack a spot no matter what).

Stormblade (Baneblade version with huge plasma cannon) & Stormsword (Baneblade version with siege cannon shells):
Both of these are defenseless vs simple melee attackers as their extra weapons for some reason fail to target anything in melee combat while the other Baneblade tanks are capable of returning fire to melee attackers, although not with all of their firepower due to turret angles and such. While both tanks are a bit better at their intended niche it's not noticeably enough to justify their own Baneblade versions, imo, and the plasma version seems to be weaker than it should be compared to the other plasma tanks and turrets when considering this is a relic unit. Both tanks also lack a tooltip information stating that they deal area damage with their main cannon and whether that's a small, medium or large one and which secondary effects (knockback, morale, friendly fire, slowdown) that causes.

Stormlord (Baneblade version with two huge Gatling-like cannons):
The tank's ability to transport infantry is downright useless. Not only are there several other ground vehicles available that can do the same, and that much faster, but also can infantry units be dropped anywhere on the battlefield via Communications Tower or Valkyre Transport unit. And it doesn't work with the way Baneblades are produced in this UA version: Ready to deepstrike upon of their construction being done, with no chance of loading any infantry in there before, to drop them along with the Baneblade. The tank itself fails to perform it's infantry supression role because it's actually only dealing single target damage at medium range instead of area damage or larger distance and also doesn't apply any secondary effects that would aid in infantry supression, such as a morale drop, as known from flamers (this Baneblade is weaker at that than a Leman Russ Inferno), movement slowdown or armor reduction. The tank doesn't even have stealth detection, so assassins can sneak past it. Imo that tank should not be more expensive than a regular Baneblade tank but cheaper because not only is it more limited in it's combat roles but also not that good at it's key role.

Overall I'd like to get tooltips of the installed main-, front- and side armaments of each Baneblade tank along with their special abilities, if they have any, special weapon effects and other things mention-worthy, such as the Stormlord's ability to transport infantry.

IMPORTANT ISSUE:
Hero units that can grant a choice to increase a certain resource cap, morale, hitpoints, production speed or a unit cap are treated as if they were dead once loaded into either a structure or transport, meaning the chosen bonus is lost once loading such a unit into any other unit or structure, even if making the unit leave that one again the previously chosen bonus isn't restored but the choice that was made remains saved on the unit. The only fix is to kill the unit, produce it again and buy the same choice again and never ever load that unit into any other unit or structure again to keep the chosen bonus. For IG specifically that's a huge issue, as the Lieutenant's Command Tank can't be manned due to that bug and without being manned the tank doesn't receive it's increased combat values. That's not solely an issue with IG heroes but with any hero <-> transport / structure loading = bonus lost. I don't know if and how Necron Deceiver mind control on a bonus granting unit affects that bonus.

Sentinel weapon choices: I've finally had the chance to test these.
-the unupgraded weapon is only useful vs regular infantry and essentially so bad that it forces to upgrade this unit with any other weapon
-the heavy flamer is good as it never misses, deals area damage, has a good rate of fire, drops morale; the low range just causes the unit to soak up much more damage so eventually an armor upgrade with that weapon choice (if that's possible) would be nice; Nerve gas & smoke launchers for Sentinels would also be nice
-the missile Launcher is nice as it is but unlike the description states there's no setup time and it has a chance to knock back targets it hits and that's not in the weapon's description; weapon concept and values look ok
-the Autocannon is a good allrounder but the confusing thing about it is that it uses the same kind of weapon as a Heavy Weapons Suppression Team while being not that good at dealing with heavy infantry; I'd switch values on that thing because the Lascannon needs a niche to work within and make the Autocannon better vs heavy infantry and worse vs structures because the weapon is currently a too good allrounder in dealing damage
-the Lascannon has a good range, never misses and is a miserable tool vs heavy infantry; vs vehicles and structures it's damage is also underwhelming; could receive a bit more range to allow kiting enemy vehicles and needs more damage to actually work within it's niche because what currently makes the weapon good is it's range and that it never misses, not it's damage, not even vs the targets it's supposed to be good against; needs a damage buff
-the Plasma Cannon misses too much and too far and needs a fix for both more accuracy and less distance of misses to not completely miss
I still think Sentinel's are IG core identity units that should be available for construction without having to install a depot before being allowed to construct them.

Thunderer / Laser Destroyer Tank:
The unit often disobeys clear target orders but instead attacks anything else, mostly noticeable with it's Laser Destroyer weapon.

Hellhound:
While good to very good early on the unit isn't of much use after that, not even with it's glorified chemical weapon. While that weapon helps dealing good damage the unit's survivability isn't too good and thus an upgrade for that unit later on that deal with this issue would be nice - mainly more armor because it's a close range unit. For some odd reason the unit lacks a smoke launcher while all other tanks have these after research. The "Let it burn" ability also damages the unit itself. Despite being a chemical kind of vehicle nerve gas launchers aren't included later on either.
While the unit is advertised as an anti infantry / anti structure unit it's not really good vs structures until receiving it's chemical weapon. It doesn't work so well vs heavy infantry either while on it's own as the unit's area effect weapon works with little effect while being surrounded by enemy heavy infantry. Maybe the flamer / chemical weapon could slow enemy infantry while hitting them to stop them from easily surrounding this unit ? With it's 3 weapon choices of Bolter, Flamer, Melta the niche only works well for the Flamer. Bolter damage isn't really a threat for anything and should actually deal enough single target damage to be of a consideration whether to use this one or the other choices. The Melta attacks too slow and for too little damage to make this unit an anti structure type, let alone being worth the risk of getting up close compared to using any siege unit from a distance or one of the Lascannon fire support teams instead. The unit's Melta damage could use both a rate of fire and damage bonus.
The unit's morale breaking effect also lacks severly. Neither the unit's presence nor weapons cause a significant morale effect. The Sisters Flamers or stun grenades compared to this unit outmatch it.

Leman Russ Eradicator:
Even when that unit misses a weapon impact effect is displayed at the target making it look like the unit hit the target for 0 damage instead of missing it.

Heavy Weapons Suppression Team: (multiple issues)
-when undeploying while at 100% the unit's health isn't 100% after being regular mobile infantry again but instead a portion of health is missing
-seems like the unit is far too weak vs melee attackers and could use a slight buff at least to die less fast vs such
-sometimes when deploying the unit runs to another position slightly off where it was ordered to deploy and then faces another direction than towards the enemy, having to turn quite some time until being able to fire again; after the enemy is gone the unit realignes the weapon to that wrong direction; I suppose this is an engine thing but if it can be fixed somehow the unit should deploy on the spot
-while deployed the unit often blocks vehicles trying to move past it; I suppose that's because vehicles are pathfinding-wise the ones that make infantry move aside when they pass by, yet this is a stationary unit that can't do this and so the vehicle gets stuck
-sometimes when undeploying and redeploying the unit elsewhere it slides back to it's previous position while deploying; after doing the same a 2nd time it works
-a mortar or missile launcher upgrade for this unit earlier on would be desired

Assassins:
They really struggle in lategame vs their intended targets because they don't deal enough damage then, also miss sometimes and bottom line it takes them too long to take out heavy infantry and certain infantry type heroes. Doesn't matter if all 3 of them are focussing such a unit with the scope damage buff - it still takes them multiple salvos to deal with that single unit. Their actual infiltration and sabotage aspect is ruined greatly by being forced to have all 3 in the same spot because their firepower can't compete vs their intended targets. Psyker spam also has the downsides that these units die fast and are affected by knockback so sometimes there's no good strategy to play then.

Imperial Brawlers:
Basically useless. Too few to actually keep larger groups of enemies busy, they take far too long to reinforce while they're also too expensive at that, they die fast, lose morale fast and restore it too slow, their leader Comissar takes an eternity to be trained once dead on the field, they're not knockback immune and thus easily interrupted from their task to hold the line and keep the enemy in combat (and there's no research that fixes that), if there's a secondary effect their attacks cause I haven't noticed it but I think there's none (and if there is it's a job for the tooltips), their damage is always mediocre or worse and I haven't noticed any difference in their usefulness no matter what kind of leader I attached to them - even with the Priest's damage buff and that even after their power fist upgrade had been researched. They don't really get better with upgrades either. Often they all just die due to their combined weaknesses no matter what I do.
To keep enemies busy in melee combat then rather Conscripts or Riders than these or later Ogryns. Special Weapon Teams have more potential with their poison knife upgrade, the ability to use grenades, train a medic and other leader type units as squad members, being able to use explosive charges and also being useful at ranged combat. The only difference is that I need to manually train and add a Comissar leader to these while it'd be a medic for the Brawlers.

Other - weapon ranges:
When having turrets on units along with upgrades for these or squad member weapon upgrade choices that all have a different range there are range issues upon attacking: The weapon with the highest range always stops all other squad members from getting up closer, even if they aren't in range to make use of their weapons. Could this be fixed somehow ? It's a thing that ruins Meltas as it's pretty annoying to always be forced to micromanage every squad that uses these because Lasguns outrange Melta weapons and cause a squad with Meltas to not attack with Meltas while ordered via autoattack - unless the enemy comes closer or micromanaged.

I'm convinced the IG could use a research for the garrisoned structures' weapons to become stronger and longer ranging along with maybe an upgrade that increases structure hitpoints (aside except walls but including tank traps) and on apocalypse perhaps also armor (this then also for walls and tank traps).

Laser Tank Destroyer:
Before upgrading to laser:
-area damage
-inaccurate shots
-fast rate of fire
-large area of effect
-attacks ignore terrain
-sometimes ignores assigned target upon order (fixable with ground attack order)

After upgrading to laser:
-single target damage
-never misses
-(very) slow rate of fire
-single target damage
-attacks require line of sight
-sometimes ignores assigned target upon order (not fixable; ground attack order no longer exists)

The tradeoff is bad. Needs either more range or damage or both or a clear anti tank- & anti titan niche and a fix to not ignore an assigned target and switch to something else instead with a rate of fire as bad as that. Before upgrading the unit's attack is very similar to the Leman Russ Demolisher's main cannon but with extra inaccuracy and after upgrading the unit is similar to the Leman Russ Annihilator but with worse rate of fire and a setup time. So all in all the unit is worse than one of the Leman Russ versions unless I'm missing some special damage niche here, while also costing just as much vehicle cap, being more limited, thanks to no side turrets, front- and top turret, having no nerve gas launchers and I believe the range is also worse than the Leman Russ Demolisher's in both weapon variants. Despite all limitations and downsides the unit costs more resources than a Leman Russ variant while being available with the same researches as them.

-----

Kasrkin Airborn Veterans:
They can train a Vox Operator as squad member but this version of that unit doesn't grant the huge vision area that the HQ built Vox Operator grants.

Chimera:
The Bolter turret upgrade could meanwhile be tested and it's good vs nothing. In fact chosing this upgrade is a downgrade of the unit's effectiveness in any situation. It's not better than the flamer it replaces, no matter the target, but always worse. The single bonus it has is more range but not a huge amount of it for all the downsides.

Any tank that can get a stubber turret upgrade:
Using this upgrade makes some tanks more ineffective, if unattended, as tanks left on auto-attack will stop at maximum range to attack. This behaviour will cause it that some tanks won't even use their main weapon, some additionally also not their other weapons, because the stubber turret's huge range causes this. Due to this each vehicle need it's own version of this upgrade that matches the main weapon's range -or- the main weapon should be the ranged weapon distance indicator, if that is possible.

HQ units as squad members:
None of the HQ units that can be squad leaders adjust their values to any squad they're attached to. Most of them die easily. Only Comissars and Priests have some chances of survival. The rest mostly dies fast because all of them always stay on a Guardsmen level with their resistances to enemy fire and health pool.

Tech rush:
Rushing the main techs is too easy. It's not the price that's the issue but the conditions when the next tech tier becomes available. This should get a timer so that the lower tech tiers along with their upgrades get some time frame in the game that they can be played with. An example of this is the IG's Sentinel: Until I've build a Sentinel Depot, created at least 1 Sentinel and researched it's 2 upgrades another player that just rushes to the next tech tier instead has automatically done better no matter what I do with that unit then because tanks beat 1-x Sentinel(s).

IG Apocalypse tier:
Reaching Apocalypse Tier with the IG feels disappointing. I get a super structure that takes a lot of space, is very expensive, takes very long to build and that needs to be upgraded yet again with another expensive, time consuming upgrade to become a true threat.
All the waiting and waiting and investing resources to then indirectly deal with the enemy is very disappointing. There's not even the choice to go for a real battle. Just sit in your base, scout the enemy, wait it out. Ugh...
There are no titan upgrades, no Baneblade improvements, no nuke upgrades, no apocalypse turrets or structure fortifications, nothing that either lets me train or equip squads and vehicles faster, there's no morale or reinforce bonus (not even for research), no extra soldier or tank slots or anything that truly allows to unleash the apocalypse. Apocalypse with the IG basically translates to boredom and disappointment. The reactor upgrades that become available have always been useless for me. The IG's power cap is lower than the requisition cap. For that reason it's easier to hit it. Most often I'd have needed extra requisition points for structures, soldiers and upgrades of squads. The reactor's +10% power upgrade would be more useful as +5% both resources upgrade. The bonus to the Baselisk is nice but feels pointless once the nuclear rounds are researched as anything in range is obliterated anyway, except some of the special units that always take more hits anyway, no matter what.

Edited by: UsernameUsernameRev

Sisters of Battle turrets, even when upgraded to multi-meltas, barely tickle AI-controlled vehicles. Chaos Predators were demolishing my listening posts and turrets (this is with uber structures AND fortress defenses enabled, by the way. Softcore/hardcore/etc are all disabled) while 10+ multi-melta turrets were focusing on them. The turrets combined were only doing around 50 hp damage per second in total. In fact, it seems most factions' turrets with anti-armor upgrades suck against what they're meant to fight.

I don't know if this has something to do with the removal of the armor system from SM and CSM vehicles. It seems it affects more than just those two faction's vehicles/"vehicles", though, as even large, non-relic Tyranid units were tanking a lot of fire from several anti-armor turrets.

Another problem is that the rules for restricting the AI only (reduced popcap, no relic units, no game enders, etc.) do not work. They still build superweapons, get commander wargear, and create Titans. Also, they produce more units than they should if the popcap reductions were working.

Edited by: Braken

Hi

Mark of nurgle isn't giving me access to the plague reaper for CSM, playing on 1.88.72

Cheers in advance

From what iv experienced (apologies if some of these were intentional changes but Iv not seen anywhere in a log that says they are)

Imperial Guard

Turrets: Turrets no longer turn into punisher autocannons but instead revert to missile based turrets after upgrade to anti vehicle, additionally end game turret research no longer increases turrets range, damage, or visual style.

Titans: Generals Reaver cannot upgrade at all no matter which doctrine or circumstance

General Command Squad: Does not have access to upgrades for the General, cannot add psykers or vox operators due to Ibrahams vestments not existing due to inability to unlock. Also cannot increase production/health/moral/relic resource via him either.

Psyker Primarius Battle squad: Cannot add members. While hovering over reinforce button it says requires Ibrahams vestments.

Commissar Cadets: Renamed Imperial Brawlers? Lack sound files for some reason.

Leman Russ Demolisher: Absolutely OP, I mean I love the Guard but holy hell this thing smashes everything to dust. Insane range, insane firepower, insane everything.

Imperial Conscripts: This is very strange, conscripts kind of, flicker? I guess. They go inbetween DOW1 Imperial Guard models, and regular Guard models with a stripe on the helmet.

This info was collected over 3 different installs, one with multiple other mods and map packs installed, and 2 completely fresh. One was a simply uninstall, delete all soulstorm related files and reinstall, the other was done on my secondary computer with no prior SoulStorm installation.