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Tiberian Eclipse is being designed to improve upon the concepts of C&C4. Improved gameplay, new features, and an evolution between Westwood's & EA's concept of tiberium will be presented. Experience the return of some of your favorite units, evolution of others, and entire new ones in what we hope will come together to make a great conclusion of the C&C: Tiberium Series.

Report RSS C&C IV Tiberian Eclipse Development Blog 1

Talk with me, ThaBo$s, one of the lead managers of the mod, about crucial development aspects of our mod

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Hello modders, and welcome to our Moddb page. As a group, we have decided on modding C&C 3 for our concepts and ideas on how C&C 4, set to release on March 6th 2010, should have been. It has taken a considerable amount of imagination and creativity to not only rethink, but redesign the rough concepts in C&C 4 to our needs as community gamers that have played through the multiplayer beta and seen what improvements could be made. This mod is only in the conceptual phase however, and as a community mod, we hope that we can get ideas and inspiration from numerous people to help with the creation of a mod that, we hope, will please everyone who has enjoyed the game play of both classic C&C and the newer, more renovated, C&C 4.

In this article, I want to present a number of concepts that we have came up with regarding the actual mechanics of the game play we hope to create. Collectively, over at our forum site Cnc4remake.forum-motion.com we have agreed that a mix of both C&C 3 game play and C&C 4 game play will be the most productive, and the most fun to play as a final product. The amount of mixing is where we run into some conflict, as we have, at this point, 3 different drafts on how the mechanics should be in-game. By sharing each pitch, we hope to have more people comment and critique on our ideas, and get some outside feedback on our planned direction.

I had posted my personal take on the matter in this pitch:

I wrote:
-Offensive Class-

Features mobile buildings that can be built in the ground control radius around the Crawler. They are built in building form, but can be packed up with minimal delay time, but are quite sluggish due to their size.

Crawler
-Repairs units and structures with repair drones anchored to it
-Can house up to 4 aircraft for rearmament
-Armed with upgradeable weapons, Most heavily armed Crawler
-Most heavily armored Crawler
-Large walker, so it can easily crush T1 and T2 units

Structure Tab
-Mobile Energy Collector: Build from ground up (Think Soviets...), But can pack up and move anywhere. They collect more energy when they are farther apart, so spacing them out is crucial to keep your power consumption at maximum efficiency.
-Mobile Refinery: Build from the ground up (^^^), but can pack up and move anywhere. Also trains Harvesters (see my econ pitch).
-Combat Support Airfield: Build from the ground up (^^^), but does not train aircraft. Immobile.
-Deployment Pad/(TBD Nod name): Like the KW versions, it enables this class to build its most powerful units (Mastodon, Widow, ect.). Only one can be built at a time, but will only build T4 units. Immobile. Has repair radius.
-Radar Tower Upgrade: Selected to be built from the Structure Tab, this would provide your Crawler with Radar
-Crawler Weapon Upgrade: Selected to be built from the Structure Tab, this would upgrade the Crawler's weapon layout (up to 3 upgrades available)
-Crawler Infrastructure Upgrade: Selected to be built from the Structure Tab, this would upgrade the Crawler's armor and speed (up to 3 upgrades available)
-Technology Clearance Upgrade: Selected to be built from the Structure Tab, this will be purchased to globally raise your technology Tier (Think Allies...)
-Power Output Upgrade: Selected to be built from the Structure Tab, being more costly than Mobile Energy Collectors, this upgrade will double the power output by the Crawler each time it is upgraded (up to 3 times).

Defense Tab
-Turrets: Will feature the smallest amount turrets to be purchased. These are mobile, meaning they can pack up and redeploy. The catch is that they when they are in mobile form, they are slow, lightly armored, and take time to redeploy, so turret pushing with these mobile turrets is much harder to accomplish

Research Tab (basically a second defense tab in-game)
-Houses up to 12 upgrades to research (3 columns of 4), with each upgrade requiring the one above it to unlock for availability (All free, but take time to research).

-Defensive Class-

The only class that has a classic themed base building. Stagnant buildings are the heaviest armored, but are still vulnerable without the proper protection. Also the only class with walls (both powered and unpowered).

Crawler
-Repairs units and structures around it with Repair Drones anchored to it. Radius size can be upgraded
-Armed with upgradeable weapons. Not as heavily armed as the Offense Crawler, but better armed than the Support Crawler
-Largest ground control radius
-Large Treaded Vehicle, so it can easily crush T1 and T2 units
-Can be upgraded to have a shield generator

Structure Tab
-Power Plant: Standard C&C power plant. Pop up deployment.
-Advanced Power Plant: Triple the power of the standard power plant, but will result in a volatile explosion when destroyed. Also leaks dangerous Tiberium radiation when critically damaged.
-Refinery: Still nothing special here. Pop up deployment. Trains Harvesters.
-Combat Support Airfield: Pop up deployment. Does not train Aircraft.
-Super Weapon: Ion Cannon/Nuclear Missile at T3. Similar to C&C 4 with different levels of charge, but are both balanced more appropriately.
-Radar Facility: Pop up deployment. Provides Radar.
-Crawler Weapon Upgrade: Selected to be built from the Structure Tab, this would upgrade the Crawler's weapon layout (up to 3 upgrades available)
-Crawler Shield Upgrade; Selected to be built from the Structure Tab, This would upgrade the Crawler's Shielding (up to 3 upgrades available)
-Technology Clearance Upgrade: Selected to be built from the Structure Tab, this will be purchased to globally raise your technology Tier (Think Allies...)
-Power Output Upgrade: Selected to be built from the Structure Tab, being more costly than Power Plants, this upgrade will double the power output by the Crawler each time it is upgraded (up to 3 times).

Defense Tab
-Turrets: Most turrets and Defenses, including Shield Generators, Cloaking Towers, ect.
-Walls: Ability to build walls, both powered (Firestorm/Laser Fencing anyone?) or un-powered
-Bunkers: self explanatory
-Faction Specific abilities: GDI's becoming temporarily invulnerable/Nod's burrowing for surprise attacks
-Outposts: Buildable to provide an amount of ground control (Sorry 'Dozer/Slave, hit the road and gtfo)

Research Tab
-Houses up to 12 upgrades to research (3 columns of 4), with each upgrade requiring the one above it to unlock for availability (All free, but take time to research).

-Support Class-

Features mobile buildings, which can pack up and repack to anywhere on the battlefield. The main difference between this and the Offensive buildings is that they must be mobile in a smaller, lightly armored "Core" form. Although this may seem like a disadvantage, these "Cores" are more mobile then their Offensive counterparts and are built directly from the Crawler in Core form, giving immediate mobility.

Crawler
-Repairs units and structures around it with Repair Drones Anchored to it. Has the largest number of Repair Drones available
-Can fly, so it is the most mobile Crawler
-Can house up to 6 aircraft for rearmament
-Can be upgraded to repair while mobile
-Smallest ground control radius to hamper team turret pushing due to mobility

Structure Tab
-Reactor Core: Built like a vehicle, it can drive out and deploy anywhere on the battlefield. Being closer to other Reactors increases their energy output, so keeping them close together provides the most amount of energy (Think Nanocore, but can repack itself to become mobile again. Different from Offense in that it is smaller and less armored when packed up, while still requiring deployment time to pack up and unpack).
-Refinery Core: Built like a vehicle, it can drive out and deploy anywhere on the battlefield (^^^). Can train Harvesters.
-Combat Support Airfield Core: Built like a vehicle, it can drive out and deploy anywhere on the battlefield (^^^)
-Uplink Command Tower: Built like a vehicle, it can drive out and deploy anywhere on the battlefield (^^^). Calls in T4 aircraft (Kodiak/Leviathan/ect.) Only one can be built at a time.
-Radar Tower Upgrade: Selected to be built from the Structure Tab, this would provide your Crawler with Radar
-Crawler Weapon Upgrade: Selected to be built from the Structure Tab, this would upgrade the Crawler's weapon layout (Up to 3 upgrades available)
-Crawler Repair Upgrade: Selected to be built from the Structure Tab, this would upgrade the Crawler's repair functions (Up to 3; each upgrade increases number of repair drones, 3rd upgrade makes the repair radius stay present when mobile)
-Technology Clearance Upgrade: Selected to be built from the Structure Tab, this will be purchased to globally raise your technology Tier (Think Allies...)
-Power Output Upgrade: Selected to be built from the Structure Tab, being more costly than Power Plants, this upgrade will double the power output by the Crawler each time it is upgraded (up to 3 times).

Defense Tab
-Turrets: Small amount of turrets, but they must be deployed like the other structures in the Structure Tab. This discourages turret pushing (^^^).
-Support Structures: Deployed like the rest of the Support class structures, they help support your team in combat (Repair Pad, Stealth Tower, Voice of Kane, ect.)

Research Tab
-Houses up to 12 upgrades to research (3 columns of 4), with each upgrade requiring the one above it to unlock for availability (All free, but take time to research).

Economy

I say that it is to focus around both the TCN and nostalgic harvesting. As we can see from some of the maps in C&C 4, not the entire planet has been reclaimed by the TCN. I say that there should be two systems of harvesting, both coinciding with each other:

-TCN - Use of either TCN Outlets as modified versions of the RA3 Ore Nodes or TCN Deposits as central areas where refined Tiberium would be held. They are both similar in the fact that they use no actual use of harvesting, but will create a field of the harvestable "stuff" on detonation. This is my idea for both:

--Outlets - Like you said bluestar, modified versions of RA3 nodes. I say that they would have 4 separate places for Harvesters to dock and fill up on refined tiberium, and once full, they return to a refinery to deposit their load.
--Deposits - Underground containment facility of refined Tiberium, harvesters would deploy and link up to the deposit around the surface node. Once filled up, the Harvesters would undeploy and return to a Refinery to deposit their load.

I don't think we should have both methods, so we would have to decide between one or the other.

-Harvestable Tiberium - either from destroyed Outlets/Deposits or from natural cracks in the surface, these are just a replica of C&C 3's resource system. All green "Riparius" tiberium can be from either fields or the TCN, but more volatile strains of tiberium like the blue "Vinifera" tiberium can only be found from natural cracks in unclaimed yellow zones and the few remaining red zones.

Class Content

The class system in C&C 4 is flawed in my opinion, since it divides up a perfectly fine army into sections that cannot fight without the use of teamwork. In my mind, each class should have full access to each type of unit, but the unit's functionality would be geared toward's it's class motif. I had previously used an example with each class' MBT and heavy tank:

GDI's MBTs
Offense - Titan - Medium armored walker mech that can crush other tanks in it's tank class, plus has a greater range from it's height
Defense - Spartan (redone) - Heavily armored quad-treaded tank which may be slow, but can deploy into a turret to gain armor and range
Support - Hunter - Lightly armed wheeled tank, designed from an APC mounted tank weapon system

GDI's Heavy Tanks
Offense - Mammoth - Quad tredded super tank that is armed with dual autocannons and rocket pods
Defense - Refractor - Quad tredded super tank, armed with a single Sonic Cannon and frontal plating that is designed to reflect off most incoming fire
Support - Vulture (new unit) - Flying weapon platform armed with quad grenade launchers and artillery rocket pods for ground targets only

As you can see, I would want each class to have a simmilarly fucntioning unit, but sculped into the class use of it's unit


A similar pitch was made by one of our other members, Borreh. He wrote:

Borreh wrote:

Main Crawler, classes Offence, Defense, Support.

Abilities:
- Upgradeable, customizable. You may upgrade it with additional support storage, armor, weapons, speed enhancements, combat special abilities, rearm pads, scanners, and so on, and so on.
- Produces the faction's combat units.
- Creates structures (Basic T1 defenses plus power plants, tiberium core reactors, tiberium processors, maybe tiberium silos. Defense gets all that plus T2/T3 defenses, and maybe some additional structures, but I am unsure are they needed.
- Upgrades other units, like in the current system.
- Houses support powers. (Basic ones for all classes except support, which gets all powers)
- Calls down supporting crawlers.

Utility Support Crawler

- When deployed next to a Node, the tiberium processors around it generate income.
- Builds Collector vehicles, repair drones.
- Upgradeable with resource and tiberium related upgrades.

Combat Support Crawler

- Upgradeable in many directions: It may either serve as a combat support crawler, communications and special abilities crawler, support factory, or a mix of all.
- Can produce T1 vehicles, upon upgrade T2.

Crawler upgrade system

Each crawler has a set number of upgrade slots that can be used to upgrade it, with Main Crawler having a large amount of them, and support crawlers having fewer. Each upgrade point costs upgrade points.

This is how it works.

Player deploys the crawler. The crawler may be upgraded for tiberium points, may build structures for credits, may build units for credits, and may call down support crawlers for a set amount of credits (but they can be deployed only in a deploy zone).

How to get credits:
Build, using the Main Crawler, Processors around the Nodes. Each Node has a set income level, given in numbers, like 100 (Example: This is just an example number, if this will be accepted, then it will be needed to be balanced). Each Processor takes a set amount of income points from that, like 10. Players will need to choose who gets to place processors near each Node. However, the processors are inactive when there is no resource crawler deployed next to them. When a player deploys such resource utility crawler near them, all the player's Processors will go online and "steal" the income from the Node (Which is legal due to military permission). The max amount of processors online may not pass the amount of income set for the Node, like: If there are 11 Processors, 10 resource points each, and the Node has income of 100, then only 10 of them can be online at the same time. If there are processors near the Node, and they don't belong to the player, then the player can deploy his utility crawler next to them and hijack them simply by selecting the crawler when deployed and then clicking on them. Players may also share the income from the Node, like 10 Processors near one Node, and each belongs to a different player. They all can be active at the same time if each player's utility crawler is deployed next to them and it's uplinked to a processor.

How to advance in tiers:

Important note: Upgrade points are no longer gained by simply entering the deploy zone.

Build Tiberium Core Reactor: It's a power plant that powers up all the T2 and then T3 upgrades remotely. Gather, using Collector Tugs (Working name) built from the utility crawler, blue or green tiberium from around the map, and bring one to the processor to install it. The processor will go online, and you will be able to tier up the same way you did before, that is: By clicking on the Tier 2 on the crawler upgrade menu with having enough upgrade points (Considering the requirement of the reactor, the amounts of upgrade points needed to tier up will be probably lowered). If you will bring blue tiberium, you will additionally get 1 upgrade point, with the reactor still going online. From then onwards, bringing tiberium to the reactor will give you upgrade points. To advance to tier 3, you will need a second reactor, activated the same way as the previous one. Reactors are expensive, so one player will need to put a lot of money to build one, and in that time he will be needing cover from other players. Upon loosing the reactor, players will be no longer able to build at their previous tier they had (E.g. I am tier 3, my team looses the reactor, we go tier 2. We loose the second one, we go tier 1). More than 2 reactors can be built, and they have purpose: They are back-up in case you loose the previous ones. Second, each reactor active serves as a point to which Tiberium can be brought using Tiberium Collectors. Three, each active serves as a super-power plant, giving few times the output of a normal power station. However, since they are expensive, they are rare.

Second important note: Tiberium Reactors are the only structures built on the battlefield, unlike all other ones which are built in the tab, and are instant pop-ups.

Quite possibly, both teams will be informed if a player will be building a reactor.

Economy & Power

Each unit and crawler, with the exception of the main crawler, which generates small income, has a set upkeep cost. It is taken from your credits income per second, from all the processors active. The better the unit, the bigger upkeep it has, with support crawlers having the biggest. That way, with no unit limits planned at this time (maybe support crawlers will need one, but I am unsure), the bigger your army is, the smaller your income is, so this should prevent spam, and make the player actually care for the units. If he wants to decommission units, then he may do so only at the landing zone: There a drop pod/subterranean vehicle will pick them up upon order, decreasing the upkeep costs. Defense structures and tiberium processors do not have upkeep, but require power from power plants. It works this way: Player, instead of a set amount of power, rather starts with 0 and builds power plants to increase it. 'nuff said.

Unit Upgrades

To increase player interest in single units and to prevent the current expendable-iness of theirs, they will be upgraded individually. It works apart from the global upgrades the crawler has - Near the crawler, units will be able to be individually upgraded with increased range, increased armor, increased speed or increased firepower (which all cost credits), plus few unit-specific ones, like gaining special abilities etc. Each unit will have a set amount of upgrade slots, ranging from one (weakest) to four or something around it (strongest T3's). However, each upgrade costs more. Plus, the last upgrade has negative effects. In case of one-slot units, the single upgrade also has negative effects.

Example:

Mastodon, 4 slots, upgraded with 1) armor by 20%, 2) armor by 20%, 3) side-attached rail guns, 4) speed by 20%. The last upgrade has a negative effect of decreasing armor by 15%.

Zone Trooper: One slot. Increased firepower by 20%, so it takes 15% range.

Avenger Tank: Two slots. Increased firepower by 20%, second slot empty, so there is no negative effect.


One final pitch was made by our member Shriken was a bit less wordy, but still held some points towards a design concept:

Shriken wrote:

Main crawler - constructs all basic base defenses and basic infantry with light vehicles

Harvester crawler - constructs harvesters and basic base defenses

mechanized crawler - heals vehicles in proximity to the crawler and constructs main vehicles force

-specialist crawlers-

comm. crawler - can be upgraded for either drop pods or ion cannon (as GDI) if nod then bring troops up from the ground and the nuclear weapons or tiberium missiles.

super unit crawler - constructs the factions super unit


Now, with these three basic concepts out to the public, we'd like some feedback and comments about what is here to be liked, improved upon, or even a few of your own ideas. Please share your thoughts, as it helps with the speed of development of this mod. Thank you for your support, and we'll see you on the battlefield.

-ThaBo$s
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Comments
Gregthegen
Gregthegen

Great concepts, which sadly, I wish EA had included in CNC4. Can't wait to play this mod.

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Lord_Sigillum
Lord_Sigillum

Your pitch sounds good, at least that way people can choose if they want to build a standard base or a moving one etc. Im looking forward to this mod being finished as what i have seen of C&C4 so far really doesnt make me want to buy it.

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Alex_06
Alex_06

Interesting...I like it in a way.
Definately wishing EA would've gone with something more exotic like you did.

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Weggyy
Weggyy

awesomei like the first pitch the best in my opinion, as for the tcn nodes as u said above i like the idea of the harvester going into an underground facility to gather tiberium. in other words keep up the great work :D

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TheHappyCrusader
TheHappyCrusader

This is definatly what C&C 4 should have done,
best of luck to ye'!

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Phantom139
Phantom139

I just read about your support class idea with the nano-core like buildings.

well, allow me to point you to my mod here:
Moddb.com

I have accomplished something very similar to this with my GFA faction and am more than willing to help you to get these working if you need the help.

Phantom

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WeedWhacker92 Author
WeedWhacker92

Quick question: are your buildings able to repack like in our pitch? As that may be a problem implementing, possibly needing a bit of advanced coding on our part.

All help will be appreciated, so thankyou Phantom139 for offering your support.

(The first pitch made by me is now the official plan, with a few minor tweaks to compromise for ppl ;) )

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Phantom139
Phantom139

While my buildings do not "Re-Pack", doing so is actually pretty easy, just look at the MCV Code, you will find a close similarity to what you are trying to accomplish there.

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rx61
rx61

cool this is how they shuold have done it same style jstu each class has special powers like in kanesr wrath like zocom tiberm invibilty that one i dont remeber had fire powoer

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Havok_88
Havok_88

I like the first idea becuase of it's pracitcallity. It seems to work out in my head and that may because of the detail in which it is described and extrapolated from exsisting technology and practices.

However, when I heard EA annouce the use of a 3 class system I was excited because I was thinking along the lines of this:

The Support Class was the class which collected tiberium and provided power for the team. Or at least specailized in that (still being allowed to create basic defenses and units to protect itself).

The defense class was the one responsible for the groups security. Providing the team with radar, turrets/bunker protection and fortifications. Also in my head (a dark and *interesting* place) i saw the defense class being able to purchase an upgrade in which fortifed the entire teams structures or upgraded another aspect of the teams defensive capability. Oh and the redemption of the tick tank somewhere here as a unit again.

The offensive class given the capablity of the previous two classes would be able to focus on unit production and patrol the corridors of the unrevield terrain. Our rushers would excell in this postion.

Again this is just how i envisioned the 3 class system. I am aware with problems this would create however I hope that the dev team would be able to take some of these ideas and maybe not make them their own but see an new idea and envision something better.

~we are always already influenced

Peace through Power

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Raketa
Raketa

Nice ideas you have there. As for the resource, I like the underground deposits)

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Vengefulnoob
Vengefulnoob

personally i think that the support crawler should still be a giant flyer, but more like a giant kodiak, which can attack by launching firehawks like the aircraft carrier in ra3 to bomb a target, and land to build airbases for other aircraft.

Also might like to think about including the gdi condor: EA made concept art for this aircraft which would have been like a firehawk but with an ion cannon, but didnt include it.

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GooberTrooper
GooberTrooper

Why Is Everything a Crawler Now? What happened to the Good Old MCV?

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moka2k10
moka2k10

i just signed up to tell you that this mod is one of the best iv ever heard, thanks to EA making a total mess of the last ever in the tiberium series, i think this will really pick up where EA went wrong. From what everyone has said i think more people will play this than the actual cnc4. i hope you guys make a really decent job out of this, campaigns, multiplayer, everything :L best of luck to you lot, moka

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