BEST editor for NPC/Bot AI and Behavior? Thread

Hello,
As some of you, I wish to create a one player map. Of course to do so you need to add some real life in your map, not just clueless Bots who will fire at you but NPC who can execute simple but varied actions : Walk, Run, playsound/speak, play animation, action trigger...
As many of you seem to have a wide experience about level design, I was wondering which of these editor is the best for doing this?
As unlike many of you I have no coding experience (but I am willing to learn! and the mutator tutorial could be a start) :

Unreal Editor (2004 or UTIII)
Half Life 2 (Valve Hammer)
Elder scrolls Construction set.

thanks for your wise opinion!

the editors to modify the NPC actions is editor tied
so you cant use the tes construction set to modify ut3 npc's (obviously)
it depends on what game you want to map for
dont know this for sure tough, but i think that in ut you will need to code the ai so it doesent behave like bots
dont know for hl2
construction set is kinda complicated for ai but it is more like "go there/do that but i dont care how you do it"
so alot of things can go wrong when they are walking somewhere (thieves anyone?)
you could allso try the cryengine sandbox 2, i messed around with it and its pretty good to do ai (the ai is sucky on its own tough, you need to tell him what to do ALOT)
and its pretty easy once you get the hang of flowgraph (=no coding )

I've never run into any interface limitations in Hammer, though of course there's only so much you can do with a single NPC's animations.

If you want to actually modify the game's AI itself you'll need to write C++.

UT2004 has a number of exellent third party frameworks built for singleplayer support.

Dark_Raver9 wrote:
you could allso try the cryengine sandbox 2, i messed around with it and its pretty good to do ai (the ai is sucky on its own tough, you need to tell him what to do ALOT) and its pretty easy once you get the hang of flowgraph (=no coding )

Excellent Dark_raver! I didn't know there was an editor for crysis. I will buy the game and try the editor as you advise. Thanks for your suggestion!

ambershee wrote: UT2004 has a number of exellent third party frameworks built for singleplayer support.

Hi Ambershee (btw nice mutators tutorials! ) I used UT 2004 editor in the past and yes you are right, there is indeed a scripted sequence actor which allow you to implement a lot of different actions (play anim, wait for event, walk, trigger...) without coding skills but I liked to try a "next gen" editor so I tried with UTIII editor which seemed powerful with loads of nice effects but unfortunately the new Graphics Interface called Kismet do not features a lot of different actions for NPC/Pawns and if you want to create your own AI subclass you need ... the magic coding skills (damn! I should have studied computer science!).

Varsity wrote: I've never run into any interface limitations in Hammer, though of course there's only so much you can do with a single NPC's animations.

Thanks Varsity, but I am not sure I understand the meaning , do you mean there is a kind of actor that controlled a NPC and where you can choose among a list of actions without coding skills?

you could allso download the crysis demo, it comes with the editor
it doesent have everything thats in the full tough (ai cant pick up stuff for example) but you can try alot with it first

Jotunheim, I was referring to downloads made by modders for UT2004. You'll have to look for them, but there is a full singleplayer framework complete with AI available, and the BeyondUnreal wiki has a good tutorial on UT2004 ai.

Got it Ambershee! even Unreal 2004 by itself (ie without mod, I used it in the past) is enough to set NPC/Pawn AI, but I will take a look at one player mod as you advised. The issue is it is an older generation editor, don't have the nice effects such as UT III (especially Texture/materials 3D relief effects and real dynamic shadow).
Anyway I bought Crysis (want to play anyway ) and I will explore tutorials about the cry engine sandbox 2 to check the AI capability. Will leave feed back soon about it. Thanks again for your suggestions!

Edited by: Jotunheim

It probably wouldn't be very difficult to port the AI code over from one to the other, if you really need the splashy visuals. UT2004 isn't exactly visually anyway

he,he...This idea has already a name called OSMT for Old School Monsta Tool (see on unrealwiki Wiki.beyondunreal.com ) it was a program aiming to transfer some code and functions from UT to UT 2004 and now Super Ape (on beyondunreal forum) intend to do the same from UT2004 to UTIII but I don't know when the project will be completed...

I know OSMT - although I wasn't aware Ape intended to port it

Hi the designers!
As previewed, I report my feed back regarding the Crysis editor Cryengine 2 and yes Thanks again Dark_Raver, your advice was 100% right mate! (btw, thanks for your tutorials for starting)

Compared to UTIII editor, the AI possibilities of the Sanbox 2 is far more superior and varied, the mechanisms to choose, place your bot, edit its behavior is much more logical, all this without Coding/Scripting skills. A lot of other details such as weather, particle, gravity, physics is more intuitive so more fun! The 3D objects database is also more realistic. So for people who do not have coding knowledges it is definitely a good choice.
Well thanks again for your very wise suggestion.

Good luck for your projects and maps!

PS : for french speaking designers there is good cryengine tutorials and a nice community on
Crysis-france.com, that's it.

Edited by: Jotunheim

Jotunheim wrote: Thanks Varsity, but I am not sure I understand the meaning , do you mean there is a kind of actor that controlled a NPC and where you can choose among a list of actions without coding skills?

You use map entities like scripted_sequence, info_node_hint and ai_goal_whatever.