Report article RSS Feed Why we removed the school shooter mod

We have removed the School Shooter mod from ModDB, read on for our explanation.

Posted by INtense! on Mar 19th, 2011

Allow me to begin this post by saying we believe in the freedom of speech, the right to share information and be creative. We have enjoyed watching mod developers push the boundaries for years and create amazing content, and shall always do this.

However, recently a mod on the site called School Shooter: North American Tour 2012 has been getting quite a bit of mainstream press due to the controversial nature of the content. It seems that people sit on two sides of the fence on this one. There are those that believe the makers of this mod should have the right to make whatever they want, while there are others that believe it is disgusting and crosses the line.

We sit on both sides, on one hand we find the content to be deliberately offensive and in poor taste, but on the other we also feel people should have the right to be creative and share what they want on a community / developer run site, and we shouldn't have the right to dictate what is/isn't allowed.

The challenge faced is we are currently receiving quite a bit of threatening mail as people believe we are the creators, supporters and makers of this content. I want to stress that this absolutely isn't the case. We have never encouraged or made any content, we disagree with the mod but at the same time believe in freedom of speech and the unique ability modders and indie developers should have to create games (good-or-bad) about topics, issues and events considered risky or taboo.

There is also quite a bit of confusion from non-gaming press, who state that games like this are the reason why all bad things occur, spreading misinformation and fear. As a result of this confusion and hate, at the moment we feel the best course of action is to remove the mod. We don't want the hard work of thousands of other mod developers to be threatened by people misunderstanding this one mod/game, and assuming all others are like it.

Edit: We did contact the developers with no reply back in August 2010, chances are this would have ended differently if they had replied.

Post comment Comments  (250 - 300 of 438)
thedeepkiss
thedeepkiss Mar 19 2011, 11:25am says:

Mod Database has failed in supporting the mod community as a whole. Your self-censorship has limited this site to the tastes of the vocal few.

If you have controversial material in here, you could have simply slapped on a huge disclaimer and warning for its contents. This is no longer a database as the name implies.

-2 votes     reply to comment
Lazy6pyro
Lazy6pyro Mar 19 2011, 11:37am replied:

You're free to click the X if ModDB is becoming a place that you don't support anymore. That's the beauty of the free Internet. You can still get all of the mods you want (albiet, probably not as easily), and you don't have to interface with a website in which you believe has failed the community. If the majority do actually believe what you assert, ModDB and Desura will fail.

+3 votes     reply to comment
ProspectGames
ProspectGames Mar 19 2011, 12:35pm replied:

"Mod Database has failed in supporting the mod community as a whole."

Mate are you sure you thought this one out? Failed in supporting the community, really? Do you know where you are right now?

+3 votes     reply to comment
anonymous32675
anonymous32675 May 2 2011, 12:03am replied:

Last I checked this wasn't the only mod they have on here.
But if you really NEED it, go elsewhere to get it. I'm sure they'll survive without you.
But from what I here, it's crap to begin with.
Guess now after all the publicity it's a must have. Now people are probably willing to pay alot to play. Talk about capitalism!

+1 vote     reply to comment
Hamtaro
Hamtaro Mar 19 2011, 11:28am says:

Seems like threats are the way to get anything you want these days. Sad...

+1 vote     reply to comment
CovertChaos
CovertChaos Mar 19 2011, 11:54am says:

Indeed it is.

+1 vote     reply to comment
Spiritlol
Spiritlol Mar 19 2011, 11:55am says:

I have to admit that I have not read through all the comments on the page on this post so if I have repeated anyone's views I apologize. I am also going to try to be adult as possible about this

Regardless of the mods content I do believe this is a low blow to freedom of expression and the right people to create what they believe needs to be created. I also find that the website known as a great host to this content is the one who caved first to the reactions of others some of whom do not know anything to do with gaming in the first place.

However this will not affect my opinion of moddb in anyway or change how I have used it and will continue to use it. It is understandable why you have done this and while I and what looks like many others disagree with you I find it a totally respectable decision for the fact that you knew that by satisfying one side the other would retort.

Everyone here who believes that this was the wrong choice and is demanding the mod be re-opened and those who are insulting the media and others who supported the decision while expected moddb to be tolerant are being absolutely hypocritical. This is a time where we must tolerate moddb decision, and for the years I have browsed this website it is the first that I have ever disagreed with. Don't let this break the community.

+4 votes     reply to comment
AJ_Quick
AJ_Quick Mar 19 2011, 12:08pm says:

I don't think this is gonna do much for moddb's image in the long run. The folks who emailed you won't suddenly stop hating on moddb / video games, because they genuinely still think video games are subversive murder simulators and that moddb is a cesspool, School shooter mod or no. All it has really shown is that pressure groups can get w.e they want, if they moan load enough.

And for the record, the mod did look pretty crap, but I probably would have downloaded it at some point to see what all the fuss was about. I'm a sheep like that : ) baaaa

+3 votes     reply to comment
Nilghai
Nilghai Mar 19 2011, 12:17pm says:

You guys made they exact right decision on this one!

+2 votes     reply to comment
Pawnstick
Pawnstick Mar 19 2011, 12:18pm says:

Thanks, the people who made those mods were *******!

+4 votes     reply to comment
Lazy6pyro
Lazy6pyro Mar 19 2011, 12:27pm replied:

You're loving this whole 4-page+ discussion stemming from your little experiment, aren't you?

+5 votes     reply to comment
Pawnstick
Pawnstick Mar 19 2011, 12:39pm replied:

I don't know who you are, but you seem like a total *******.

0 votes     reply to comment
Lazy6pyro
Lazy6pyro Mar 19 2011, 12:42pm replied:

Well, thanks. Coming from you, that's a pretty big compliment.

+3 votes     reply to comment
DuckSauce
DuckSauce Mar 19 2011, 2:02pm replied:

Hilarious how you got people to + vote the one who's been making the **** they're hating on. Well played on that, I give you that.

+2 votes     reply to comment
TeddyLeach
TeddyLeach Mar 19 2011, 12:32pm says:

Hmm, wasn't Jack Thompson banned from practicing law? Or was that in only a certain state? My American Law is a little rusty.

+1 vote     reply to comment
Khameli
Khameli Mar 19 2011, 12:39pm says:

well da, who the hell is even doing that kind of sick mod... right choice from moddb to delete it, i dont get it why in hell would some1 even think of making mod like that... those who think this is "freedom of speech" should try to undertstand how it feels to loose some1 in that kind of tragedy.. and if he/she cant, then his as twisted as those shooters

0 votes     reply to comment
Lazy6pyro
Lazy6pyro Mar 19 2011, 12:41pm replied:

He's three comments above you, named Pawnstick. He's just trolling all of you and ModDB. TBH: I give the website another update before I can't find any more avenues to troll and let's it die a successful troll mod.

+3 votes     reply to comment
Jimo
Jimo Mar 19 2011, 12:42pm says:

I don't understand why you would make a game which you KNEW would give you flak and then cave when you get flak. If that was going to happen why even make it in the first place??

-4 votes     reply to comment
moppop
moppop Mar 19 2011, 6:57pm replied:

ModDB didn't make the game. They have no association with the game; they don't endorse it; don't host it. The Checkerboard leaches were only using the already popular avenues of ModDB to promote their work, and ModDB was getting caught in the middle of the fire-fight.

+2 votes     reply to comment
DrThompson
DrThompson Mar 19 2011, 12:45pm says:

ITT: Internet Arguments

+2 votes     reply to comment
moppop
moppop Mar 19 2011, 12:48pm replied:

ITT: Pawnstick trolling all. +9001 Internets and all teh PUDDI to Pawnstick.

0 votes     reply to comment
DougBailey
DougBailey Mar 19 2011, 12:56pm buried:

(buried)

INtense! is an arm-chair communist liberal queer loving abortion doctor. He talks about how much he "looooves" freedom of speech and then BAM he takes it away from Mr. Stick. You sicken me. You cave because a bunch of whiny baby liberals e-mail you about how they are still sad about Columbine - NEWS FLASH: IT HAPPENED 10 YEARS AGO. NOBODY REALLY CARES ANYMORE.

Sounds like he just got trolled into denying a user from expressing his rights through his mod database system.

You heard it here first folks: INtense! hates video gamers.

-9 votes     reply to comment
moppop
moppop Mar 19 2011, 1:01pm replied:

Sorry Doug but my troll-O-meter is ready terribly low. You've got to try again if you want to reach Pawnstick and Weev status. Audience, should we give DougBailey another shot?

+3 votes     reply to comment
DougBailey
DougBailey Mar 19 2011, 1:08pm buried:

(buried)

As a close personal friend of Pawnstick and lead modeler for School Schooter: Source, I feel like I have a clearer perspective than you on the matter at hand... seeing as I am directly involved... Please log out and stop responding before you embarrass yourself further Mr. "Pop."

Anyways my best friend Pawnstick was never contacted regarding the removal of SS:S, not at the e-mail he used to register the mod or any other e-mail for that matter.

http://gyazo.com/56715f5afcef86a0cf46affefa4e93a8.png

-6 votes     reply to comment
moppop
moppop Mar 19 2011, 1:10pm replied:

Oh snap, you're not Anonymous any more! Update your site!!!!! GOGOGOGO

Mark my words Doug Bailey. You made a big mistake associating your name with this mod.

+2 votes     reply to comment
moppop
moppop Mar 19 2011, 1:17pm replied:

Now, please release the mod on Rapidshare. I will then proceed to totaly re-do your work, and give you, Doug Bailey, all the credit as I shop around for Oprah and the other REAL big stories. You wanted to be an Internet sensation: you got it.

+2 votes     reply to comment
DougBailey
DougBailey Mar 19 2011, 1:17pm replied:

I have a PlayStation 3 and I LOVE IT!!!

-2 votes     reply to comment
moppop
moppop Mar 19 2011, 1:26pm replied:

Why weren't you man enough to associate your name with the mod originally? Only when your precisions little secret is trampled is when you let the cat out of the bag.

+2 votes     reply to comment
Henley Staff
Henley Mar 19 2011, 11:41pm replied:

I.imgur.com sure you wasnt

+4 votes   reply to comment
moppop
moppop Mar 20 2011, 12:06am replied:

In b4 the 'Shopped accusations come flying out

+3 votes     reply to comment
version15
version15 Mar 19 2011, 10:24pm replied:

What an idiot... but nice try dougbailey.

+2 votes     reply to comment
FuzzyMcDoodle
FuzzyMcDoodle Mar 19 2011, 12:58pm says:

Good job, there is a point when things go to far and don't do any good. This mod will not be missed by many, and certainly not by me.

+4 votes     reply to comment
ytres
ytres Mar 19 2011, 1:16pm replied:

You sound hypocritical.

0 votes     reply to comment
JBJF14
JBJF14 Mar 19 2011, 1:10pm says:

Wow, epic trolling. I think the decision to remove this mod was the correct one. Allow me to quote the terms of use
"ModDB moderators retain the right to remove any content from personal and gaming profiles in breach of the above and will deal with the member responsible in the manner they deem necessary."
In creating accounts, games, mods, etc... you as ModDB account.. people, have agreed to this terms of use. DEAL WITH IT!

+3 votes     reply to comment
DougBailey
DougBailey Mar 19 2011, 1:16pm replied:

Allow me to quote a piece of your quote from the Terms of Use, "ModDB moderators retain the right to remove any content from personal and gaming profiles in breach of the above." Now please return to the Terms of Use page and read the aforementioned list of reasons for a mod to be removed - did any of them apply to School Shooter? This is a political move by mega-baby INtense!, who has violated the Terms of Use and agreement with his users he created for his own website. What a shameless pleb.

-4 votes     reply to comment
moppop
moppop Mar 19 2011, 1:19pm replied:

But Doug Bailey a sick, twisted individual that wants people to shoot up schools.

+2 votes     reply to comment
JBJF14
JBJF14 Mar 19 2011, 3:37pm replied:

I did not notice that none of the afore mentioned applied. Thank you for showing me my error. And for not trolling.

+1 vote     reply to comment
ytres
ytres Mar 19 2011, 1:16pm says:

If you "seriously" support free speech, 100%. Then removing this would not go well with that.

People don't seem to realize that when you support a cause or idea, you must also support and be willing to deal with the consequences and the backlashes of that cause or idea. Free Speech is nice, it allows people to have their say, to be expressive, an individual. But that means people can also say and make things that you don't agree with, or that are very controversial. You can't do anything about it, because you stood up for "free speech".

That's where a lot of people become very hypocritical.

However, I'm not calling Intense a hypocrite, because in order to register on the site (and therefore make the mod page), you agree to the ModDB Terms of Use. They specifically state that moderators and administrators reserve the right to remove content for any reason that may occur to them.

+2 votes     reply to comment
Spartan0536
Spartan0536 Mar 19 2011, 1:20pm says:

Occupation Source & WIC Modern Warfare Mod Dev Here.....

I am working on two VERY violent war type games with a realistic basis. While I know and understand that REAL VIOLENCE sucks and wrecks havoc on a persons mind (I'm military, been there done that), I also understand that "killing" your friends and enemies on a virtual battlefield is immensely entertaining. The human race is founded on the principle of VIOLENCE, don't believe me??? Examples... Demolition work on buildings people will stand and wait for the detonation to begin so that they can see a building blow up, Ancient Rome had the Colosseum where they enacted with REAL PHYSICAL VIOLENCE Navy and Army battles and Rome was the most CULTURED civilization at that time. Even ancient China and Japan had wrestling and armed combat matches that spectators watched for entertainment. Ever watch the show COPS, would you still watch it if all they showed was the office where paperwork is applied? North American School Shooter is a very poor idea of a mod/game however in the USA we have CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS and one of them is FREEDOM OF SPEECH, which with modern subclauses allows us to make content at will as long as it does not violate anyone's freedoms, NASS:2012 did NOT violate anyone's freedoms, therefore this action by MODDB is UNCONSTITUTIONAL, and needs to be redacted. I do not support the mod in its idea but I do support constitutional rights, why not ban the 2 mods that I am working on, we certainly are violent...Occupation Source is a FPS with REAL BALLISTICS, I personally went out and went through thousands of real world bullets to bring in the nastiest hardest hitting bullets into a mod that features body cavity damages and very fast violent combat.That's it for my 2 cents worth, take it for what it is (a grain of salt). See You On The Battlefield

-3 votes     reply to comment
Dušek
Dušek Mar 19 2011, 3:05pm replied:

The first amendment protects freedom of speech from GOVERNMENT interference, not from private organizations like ModDB. ModDB owns the site and is well within their rights to remove content or users as they wish, just like you're free to kick someone out of your house if you don't like what he has to say. That's not unconstitutional.

Nice plug though :)

+6 votes     reply to comment
SM_Sith_Lord
SM_Sith_Lord Mar 19 2011, 1:24pm says:

Modern Warfare 2 had extra offensive content like this, and they just put a warning on it and the option to skip the mission. Maybe putting a big advisory on their ModDb profile that lets you either proceed or go back would keep everybody happy.

+2 votes     reply to comment
HeadClot
HeadClot Mar 19 2011, 1:27pm replied:

I belive that they did do that and they put that they do not support or condone such acts

+2 votes     reply to comment
Deuce_Savage
Deuce_Savage Mar 19 2011, 1:30pm buried:

(buried)

It would appear the Supreme Court just got the paint brush stuck up thier yin yangs to allow this violation of the peoples contitutional rights to proceed! Tommorrow there will be gulags for all modders! Maybe Cabbage Patch Dolls are more sadistic, excessively violent causing heart failures on a dailey basis! I would'nt play that shooter mod myself but in principal people fought & died to protect your way of life so one faint of heart hero, cough, cough, can cry wolf & spit on the constitution!

-5 votes     reply to comment
moppop
moppop Mar 19 2011, 1:38pm replied:

ModDB isn't a country. It's a privately-owned website that can do whatever they want for whatever reason they choose. They can lie and say things about freedom of speech and expression all they want, but it doesn't apply to them.

+6 votes     reply to comment
DougBailey
DougBailey Mar 19 2011, 1:41pm buried:

(buried)

So what you're saying is they are hypocrites? Yes... Yes I agree. Astute observation, Dr. Pop.

-5 votes     reply to comment
Spartan0536
Spartan0536 Mar 19 2011, 1:44pm replied:

Not entirely true, if their Database Servers are in the USA they are governed by US Law, while net neutrality is still in effect, the rights of any American citizen are to be upheld while in American Jurisdiction, therefore if this mod had Americans on the team and the Mod was hosted on an American Server, their Constitutional Rights have just been violated.

-2 votes     reply to comment
moppop
moppop Mar 19 2011, 1:53pm replied:

I will actually pay up to $100 to let a judge take a look at this case. I want to see his laughter as he throws out this case.

You are wholely uninformed about Net Neutrality. It is centered around Internet Providers, not individual websites.

+3 votes     reply to comment
Cryrid
Cryrid Mar 19 2011, 1:44pm says:

I've been saying mods like this would cause problems with the media/parents/victims for a while now, so I can't say I'm surprised it happened.

For those going on about freedom of speech, you do realize that ModDB is a website, not your government? This is a site they own, and they can remove what they want whenever they want. The terms of use for this site has only said for years now that "This is not a Free Speech Forum or Venue", why make a fuss about suddenly realizing this?

At the end of the day ModDB/IndieDB/Desura has to decide what is best for them and base their decisions around that. If they're in the process of working with other companies or getting advertisers to help support the financial aspect of the service they provide, issues like this need to be ironed out. Like it or not (I'm sure we all don't), even if it isn't content they've made the association is still going to be there. For this reason I wouldn't expect to see any rape sims, mods where you play as the KKK and go around beating up African Americans and homosexuals, addons where you can go to a supermarket and shoot a senator in the back of the head (and spray bullets into anyone else in the area, including little children), etc. If people have the right to make these mods and you want to defend that freedom, ModDB and its staff should be expected to have the right whether or not they wish to showcase them and finance the bandwidth for it. It's a two-way street. If you're going to cry about freedoms, you'd be a hypocrite for not defending ModDB's freedom to do this.

+8 votes     reply to comment
DougBailey
DougBailey Mar 19 2011, 2:05pm replied:

Did you read their statement? They said they want to stand up for the mod so everyone can have the right to say what they want through the creative process but they immediately rescind their own comment and remove the mod. This is the dictionary definition of hypocrisy. Stop replying.

-4 votes     reply to comment
moppop
moppop Mar 19 2011, 2:13pm replied:

So, what are you going to do about it? Nothing. You have no power; you even have no responses on your ****** little forum. No one gives a ****.

+6 votes     reply to comment
Cryrid
Cryrid Mar 19 2011, 5:15pm replied:

Apparently you didn't. They said they were sitting on the fence, and ultimately did what is in their own best interest. In life there is often a difference between doing what you want to do, and doing what you need to.

Touche on the irony of trying to tell me to stop replying though.

+3 votes     reply to comment
Attila1945
Attila1945 Mar 19 2011, 1:52pm says:

Well, this was a stupid trolling mod. The team wanted to be famous, but they can't able to do something good, so they decided to make something flagrancy. I never liked this mod, but I noticed thanks to its name. About its quality, why they not able to make new human models? Anyway they have won, because they are famous now...

+3 votes     reply to comment
Nokiaman
Nokiaman Mar 19 2011, 1:57pm says:

Good job being babies.

-3 votes     reply to comment
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