Report article RSS Feed No mod support for Battlefield 3

Seems the game is too complex for us modders, and so mod tools will be missing from the PC release of BF3.

Posted by INtense! on Jul 5th, 2011

Battlefield has had a proud history on ModDB with mods including Project Reality, Forgotten Hope 2, First Strike and others dominating our annual mod of the year awards. Despite this, news has just come out (and confirmed our fears) that Battlefield 3 will not include mod tools, and instead EA are looking at other ways to "appease" the modding community. DICE executive Patrick Soderlund speaking to German Gamestar magazine (via Battlefieldo) confirmed this in the video below:

When asked about modding, Patrick said:

Quote:It’s going to be very difficult for people to mod the game, because of the nature of the set up of levels, of the destruction and all those things… it’s quite tricky. So we think it’s going to be too big of a challenge for people to make a mod.

Earlier in an interview with Game Informer Patrick was uncertain how modding would look for BF2. Given this was over 4 months ago and no decision has been made since then, it sounds like even basic tools maybe some way off (assuming they are in the pipeline to be made at all):

Quote:We will not deliver mod tools in the way that we delivered them for Battlefield 2 ... Creating mod tools today - dumbing them down - takes a lot of energy and what we are discussing more every day is, 'Where do we put our focus?' ... Right now our focus is to create the best possible multiplayer, single-player, and co-op game -- the core game of Battlefield 3," he added. "We're still discussing how we handle modifications of any kind.

This news follows in the footsteps of CoD: MW2 who also shunned the mod community despite a lot of success and great ideas coming from CoD 4 modders. Hopefully they will realize their mistake and do a backflip, as CoD did with Black Ops bringing back mod support.

After all to back up their claim of BF2 been a PC first, consoles second game - it is critical that they put their weight behind the PC community and enable them to unleash their modding creativity on the game.

Post comment Comments  (350 - 400 of 406)
deadrawkstar Jul 10 2011, 4:53am says:

I just think before DICE even started work on this they should have looked back and saw the immense modding community, and anticipated people to want to mod the game.

In my opinion, if a company as small as unknown worlds with 6 people can completely develop their own engine, and make it modder friendly, why cant DICE? - who probably has a large amount of money, time, and personnel.

+2 votes     reply to comment
Ice_Man_120 Jul 10 2011, 5:45am says:

Sorry but nothing is too complex for people these days, Modding has became a sixth sense in the human race. Don't tell us it's too complicated.

The game designers managed it and over time we could be making mods with the engine. Make the modding tools and give us a chance. Please !!!!

+1 vote     reply to comment
GamerBob94 Jul 10 2011, 1:09pm says:

This is easily going to be one of the best games of 2011, along with Skyrim and Portal 2 ^_^

+1 vote     reply to comment
Sev-RC- Jul 10 2011, 1:45pm says:

I just love how people go though and rate down comments they don't like.

+1 vote     reply to comment
Andris6000 Jul 10 2011, 7:09pm says:

No mod support for a battlefield game? game will ******* fail. MODS KEEP BF ALIVE

+1 vote     reply to comment
Woozle Jul 11 2011, 1:16pm says:

Not surprised one but.

+2 votes     reply to comment
iains Jul 11 2011, 3:50pm says:

Utter rubbish. They just want to charge us money for their DLC - they're scared of modders.

EA can suck my-

+2 votes     reply to comment
moppop Jul 11 2011, 8:36pm replied:

Word is that EA also caused 9/11 and the Holocaust.

-2 votes     reply to comment
aidas2 Jul 21 2011, 8:03am replied:

8 pages of non stop trolling, damn man, you have some nervers or you're just very lonely and don't socialize with real human beings at all.

+3 votes     reply to comment
Stealthrellik Jul 11 2011, 7:21pm says:

U know I still have hope BF3 will allow some modders... I mean Black Sand Studios got recognized for their outstanding work with PR. Im hoping DICE offers them some sort of SDK to work with

+2 votes     reply to comment
Der_Nibelung Jul 12 2011, 8:24am says:

I'm just a plain consumer and know very little about modding.
So I was getting my hopes up to see a MechWarrior LivingLegends mod for BF3.
I've been trying to read some of your past comments to fully understand the 'no mod support' for BF3, but all I saw were asterisk, ambulances and a bag of doritos (LOL)
Plain and simple, why do you think they don't want to release modding tools?

+1 vote     reply to comment
-Str!ker- Jul 12 2011, 2:02pm replied:

It's not a matter of not wanting too. Check out my link on page 7 and it will explain the problems with the Frostbite engine. In short, it was designed as an in house tool with support of an extensive IT network to maximize productivity. Porting this over to individual computers or smaller networks would require rewriting of the engine which is not a focus right now on a game that's not even release yet.

+5 votes     reply to comment
Der_Nibelung Jul 12 2011, 7:40pm replied:

Quick and easy answer... thanks

0 votes     reply to comment
665 Jul 12 2011, 1:59pm says:

That's, just another reason to use open source engines, instead of commercial or pseudo-free ones like unity, udk, whatever...

so now id give us the source for tech 4!

+1 vote     reply to comment
staradder92 Jul 12 2011, 2:22pm says:

Oh well

+1 vote     reply to comment
xalener Jul 13 2011, 3:15pm says:

I think people are missing the point.

He's trying to say that Frostbite 2.0 sucks to use. As someone else here put it, it's so bad that you would have to get paid to use it, which they do.

The end result we've been seeing sure looks good, but if I have to compile a map for two weeks and then restart because it crashes right at the end, then **** that ****.

+1 vote     reply to comment
ENCLAVE99 Jul 13 2011, 5:49pm says:

I will be dissapointed if we can't mod the Frostbite 2.0 engine but hopefuly EA will still give the PC community dedicated servers so Battlefield 3 won't be nicknamed Battlefail 3 like MW 2 was.

0 votes     reply to comment
SolidFake Jul 13 2011, 7:12pm says:

lol, what a lame excuse
their main objective is too either not make the console folks angry by giving the pc version too much modding power or just cause they don't want to release an undocumented or not so well documented sdk.
But too complicate... I've seen Starcraft mappers increasing the engine power by using simple map triggers, I've seen modders putting more effort into their modifications than the original developers into the game, I've seen everything which seemed to be "complicate", but if there is a way, a modder will find it.
It's just that you would tell a hacker the firewall is too complicate, he will laugh and tell you nothing is too complicate, you just need the time to understand it.

+1 vote     reply to comment
-Str!ker- Jul 14 2011, 12:20am replied:

No that's not it. Modding challenges in Frostbite were established well before BFBC2 came out. It is not a matter of being difficult or complicated, it's the matter of it requiring a large network of computers along, something that not all mod teams have access to. In order to make it mod friendly, they would have to rewrite whole parts of the engine involving the pipeline and compiling. Now if your a developer with an unreleased game do you spend time on the unfinished game or mod tools? It is a matter of priorities. Modding is not completely out of the question at a later date. Please use some sense and logic instead of all this conspiracy theory crap.

+2 votes     reply to comment
SolidFake Jul 14 2011, 6:03am replied:

So what is a challenge?
Getting together a network of pcs? No, a challenge for a modder is to establish or understand something difficult or hard to understand, that's a challenge. I can see nowhere that they said they don't include modding tools because people wouldn't have the hardware to do something with it, they clearly said that it is the complexity of the engine which makes them think that people can't handle it (it's tricky).

For sure a developer should put his focus onto bringing the unfinished game into a polished state, and making modding tools should ever be a lower priority, cause modding tools alone makes no money. Rofl, I mean, did I say anywhere that they should stop working on the game and lay all focus down on bringing the modding tools to life? No. Like I said, the reason cause they won't release it is because it would need too much work (and time) to make the sdk userfriendly and documented, there's no "conspiracy theory" in there, it's the most common sense you can get.

-1 votes     reply to comment
-Str!ker- Jul 14 2011, 12:45pm replied:

Sorry, I was just covering my bases because so many that post jump to conclusions and post about controversy because lets face it...its more interesting sometimes.

If you read my link here... ...they do say that there is a large network in the process that limits modding as well as a few other issues. They even go over what workarounds could be done to get modding of Frostbite to the masses. Your right in the idea that developing the tools will take a long time but it's not for documentation issues. They would be happy releasing the editor along with example maps to show whats needed to get a game running and for people like me that's how I often learn a new engine. The real work and time that we see for BF3 modding is the recoding of the engine to make it mod friendly.

I personally do not agree that DICE should of even developed an engine with no hope of the easy implementation of modding considering their history. But they didn't and went down a route that made the developing process easier for them instead. As a part time modder, I can respect that they did what they felt was right in order to deliver a good product. I mean who knows, maybe in a few months if engine issues are worked out we can see modding tools that won't be as much of a headache as they describe. The sky is not falling yet and we will just have to wait and see how things unfold.

+6 votes     reply to comment
BunnyJen Jul 14 2011, 9:50am says:

Developers spend a lot of money and a lot of time creating these tools, which they are not in any way obliged to release to the public, and why should they? So I don't think anyone really has any right to be annoyed at them. It's awesome if they do release the tools, but people seem to forget that they don't HAVE to and essentially they're handing out tools for free. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for modding and want tools to be released also, but perhaps people are forgetting this main point as they're so used to getting free handouts.

+3 votes     reply to comment
ManSh00ter Jul 14 2011, 12:42pm says:

For me, an unmodable system is a poorly designed system. So I think we should pity the poor developers... who knows what kind of hellish hoops they had to jump through to make this game work in the first place.

Not to mention that they probably want to sell extra maps as DLC and don't want moders offering superior content for free and ruining their ride.

Wait... is EA involved in this? Ah, yes. It makes sense now.

+1 vote     reply to comment
Distort Jul 15 2011, 3:56pm replied:

It shows that there could be very messy (and perhaps glitchy) code. Only time will tell.

+1 vote     reply to comment
dave_5430 Jul 15 2011, 6:06am says:

Whelp, can't say that I blaim them. Modding tools nowadays, especially with a system as advanced as BF3's, could take a lot of time to produce properly to be useable by everyone, without going through a 500 page manual first.

... besides, everyone knows EA is too lazy to get off their arses 3/4th of the time... look at all the bugs n glitches in BC 2 >.>

+1 vote     reply to comment
ManSh00ter Jul 15 2011, 6:52am says:

It's funny - every game to date always brags how advanced it is, and we players end up with same regurgitated been-there-done-that. I'll wait for the game to come out to judge if it really IS advanced, or just a heap of poorly optimized, unnecessary eyecandy wrapping pretending to be actual innovation.

+2 votes     reply to comment
Distort Jul 15 2011, 3:55pm says:

I beg to differ.

+1 vote     reply to comment
SlayerX3 Jul 16 2011, 12:20am says:

Bad news, but I hope this doesn't stop Modders from around the world to try to tame this precious jewel of a game.

This game is brand new so we may not have now but we can hope for an SDK or at least minor mod support in the future.

+3 votes     reply to comment
JamesFredd Jul 16 2011, 5:42am says:

Like many other people have posted before- they may have a Development Kit in the future after they actually Finish the game. Modding is fun, I do a little mapping on the UDK (Yeah, I know, original, but the Source Development Kit just doesn't look good enough for me, and frankly, id's 4th engine is on source code que.) If they don't come out with modding tools for frostbyte 2.0, some hardcore modders will find a way to utilize it, while other modders will complain a little, then go on with their lives. So basically, if it comes out, HELL YEAH, if it doesn't, oh well. (By the way, 3ds Max 2012 is ****ing kick-***.)

0 votes     reply to comment
Sgt_Prof Jul 17 2011, 1:21pm says:

I think no mod support for Bf3 is bad. EA think a lot of players have bad PC, don't have time, forgot some people entusiasm. Here are a lot of entusiasm peoples, they have time, good PC,ideas, so why EA canceled Mod sopport ? I know some pleople who spend a month and more on e.g. FarCry2 mapping, BF2, others, so why it be too big challange ?

sorry for bad english

+2 votes     reply to comment
Dra6o0n Jul 17 2011, 3:24pm says:

People should STFU about modding and whining about modding, and start making a indie!

Really? Being a pro in modding? That's not really professionalism, that's just work. If you want to aim to be a pro, you break out of modding and ACTUALLY create a indie game.

Modding basically gets you nowhere unless you go indie or work for a game company... In fact that's your only two choices other than non-gaming routes.

So don't start on mod this and mod that. Without indies or games in general, you guys won't have mods at all!

-4 votes     reply to comment
prax Jul 18 2011, 2:23am says:

Too complicated... sure...

More like "We don't want BF3 be played as long as BF2. We want to shove out a sequel faster so we make more money.
Mods would also make our income from future DLC obsolete. Why should we allow Modders to make content and make us losing money? Not gonna happen guys. Instead we call you to dumb to mod our game and laugh our ***** off on your reactions :trollface:"

+3 votes     reply to comment
xalener Jul 18 2011, 4:59pm replied:

Too complicated as in "if you don't have 20 rigs daisy chained to a server for compiling everything, it just won't work"

Get your head out of your ***.

0 votes     reply to comment
prax Jul 19 2011, 11:58pm replied:

Maybe you should get yours out of your *** first. Since Santa Claus isn't in there. I don't know if anyone told you, he isn't real. Neither is the Easter Bunny.

Developing is harsch business these days. And they don't want modders to prevent them from cashing in on the DLC buying Lemmings. It's simple as that. From a business perspective it's totally normal.
But hey, who am I telling you this. Be as gullible as you prefer.
But be assured that the laughs are on your cost.

I'll gladly give my hard earned money to developers who deserve it because they care for their community. And in my case that will be Tripwire with their upcoming title RO2. Which got the better gameplay mechanics, especially for competitive gaming anyway.

+1 vote     reply to comment
Draakon Jul 20 2011, 5:34am replied:

I'm sorry, what? That is another lame excuse for EA not to support the modding community. Although, it's theoretically possible that DICE has set up their development plan in a way where they require a network of computers (It does help actually, smoother management and what not), it's a complete BS to use it as a reason for not bringing mod support. They just have all their programs scattered around the network, but they are just fools, because if you require 20 or so computers to compile something, you are indeed a complete fool. Since the day's of video game programming, you do not require a super computer to compile something, since C++, C# and other development codes haven't changed that way they require a super computer to compile. It's just a freaking code lines you make it into binary code for your computer to understand when you run it. EA and DICE, this is just a complete non-sense.

+1 vote     reply to comment
Conchobhar Jul 19 2011, 12:17pm says:

I dont buy it, tell us we are dummies and it's too hard as an excuse.

+1 vote     reply to comment
nbohr1more Jul 20 2011, 7:48pm says:

The last claim I saw was that their map compiler requires "RAW" art assets so that tons of config file lines do not need to be parsed at load time. I think that the mod community would gladly accept longer load times for the ability to mod on this engine. The real big stumbling block is the stupidity over content protection. So what if the raw art assets are exposed to the public? Are we to believe that someone will reverse engineer the whole engine with this access? Are we to believe that EA wouldn't be in the same boat policing piracy with cracked games verses raw content sharing? (In fact it would be less of a problem because raw content means nothing to the typical end-user pirate downloader.) It's just poor understanding of the realities of the internet and piracy. The game will get cracked anyway, why impeded mods' "value added" free content that provides incentives for folks to purchase the game even outside it's target market. How many folk have bought Doom 3 for either The Dark Mod or Hexen Edge of Chaos? More relevant, how many have purchased BF1942 for the Galactic Conquest mod. Short sighted nonsense by folks who don't grasp things too well. Hrmph! Why make it harder for prospective licensees to test out the engine. It's not like any publisher would sell content made from unauthorized content anyway.... what's the fear there? Is EA planning on milking licensees for support costs?

Is having users only content expansion option be DLC the real motive? That's baloney too. There are OTHER GAMES out there if the kids get bored with BF3. They aren't gonna be held hostage to buying EA DLC anyway. Spend $$$ on DLC that was essentially sold through extortion or just spend the $$$ at GOG or Steam on another low cost title (thousands to choose from). Hmmm.

+1 vote     reply to comment
Foxtrop Jul 20 2011, 10:37pm says:

Well they should do better tools, also better a engine, they call battlefield at an overpower modern warefare, where is the 32vs32 player with moveable aircraft carrier game, that was battlefield

+1 vote     reply to comment
JSHuiting Jul 21 2011, 9:40am says:

Just out of curioisy but wouldn't it be possible to mod BF3 without a official Development Kit? Like using third party tools? If i remember correctly there were some for BF2. Also all the GTA's were modded without them. Correct me if i'm wrong, might learn something about it.

+1 vote     reply to comment
nbohr1more Jul 21 2011, 10:43pm replied:

Very difficult AFAICT (probably impossible). You'd basically need to reverse-engineer the RAW content compiler so you could deliver an understood format to the engine. Even then, map content may be signed so a 3rd party map would probably kick-off a DRM measure. You'd have to crack the product and reverse engineer the content format... The only way I can see this happening is if a hacker group posts the engine source code...

+1 vote     reply to comment
-Str!ker- Jul 22 2011, 3:48am replied:

Yea there has been little success with modding Frostbite without tools. In fact I have seen zero modifications for BFBC2 so this seems to be widespread.

+1 vote     reply to comment
Stealthrellik Jul 23 2011, 5:52pm says:

im still ****** bf3 isnt mod-able... IMAGINE PR AND FH2 ON THIS ENGINE :(

+1 vote     reply to comment
tman29th Jul 24 2011, 1:30am says:

Thankfully Tripwire will keep supporting its modding community for Red Orchestra 2 :)

+2 votes     reply to comment
CrumbleShake Jul 25 2011, 5:37pm says:

lol, EA.
How am I not surprised?

+3 votes     reply to comment
Mr.Dangerous Jul 28 2011, 9:32pm says:

they need to let us decide if its to complicated.

+1 vote     reply to comment
DeV-xC Aug 1 2011, 6:35am says:

Thats ********, when ask about SDK for BC2 they said no SDK becoz of cheats ... kk now it's to complex engine my gueass is that most will be hardcoded and no way to mod. Is the game will be better becoz of that ? BC2 wasn't...

+1 vote     reply to comment
Ricochet_Saw Aug 6 2011, 12:04am says:

OK, let me fill everyone in on the details... The real reason is because there is code in the game that contradicts what they say. They say they are using ant, they totally aren't everything is scripted...

+1 vote     reply to comment
AniCator Aug 7 2011, 3:01am says:

Well. I guess that means I'm going to have to go back into the Source SDK and code in some more dynamic lights. :P lol

+1 vote     reply to comment
SakuyaFM Aug 7 2011, 10:09am says:

Well then... Time to switch to CE3.

+1 vote     reply to comment
chockimon Aug 8 2011, 9:23am says:

This has nothing to do with complexity, but everything to do with money and greed. Why allow modders to create great mods and maps for free, when you can simply release over priced DLC and milk gamers like a farmer milks a cow. :)

+1 vote     reply to comment
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