Confederate revolutionaries "stealth tactic" Thread - Red Alert 3 Paradox mod for C&C: Red Alert 3

Currently I find that although the confederates are using old technology they seem to be expert at stealth with their tanks being able to hide (introduced in Apocalypse mod) and their PAWI trucks and towers which are very handy even against the hardest opponent. So what I think is that We should alter or at least lower the confederates level of stealth considering that that is not the look they are going for. So what should be done? Get ride of the stealth completely? Just tone it down a bit? Or make a change to how the system for the stealth towers and trucks work. I am not saying i am against the idea in fact I love the stealth because it reminds me of the GlA. But i think it just looks a little out of place considering their technology and general appearance.

Eh, the Confederates are usually most known as "the stealth faction", really.

They use a ton of old stuff- and the fiber optic cloaking some of their units use is actually outdated- but PAWI technology is supposed to represent an area where they are technologically ahead.

The Confederates may generally be low-tech, but Spiral technology, Resonance technology, and PAWI, a more advanced form of GAP tech represent the areas that they are technologically superior in. Open_Sketchbook (mod leader) said once that he doesn't like the concept of faction technology levels because each faction has proficiencies and deficiencies in different areas- albeit in a total sum of technological advancement the Allies are the most ahead.

Lore-wise, the Confederates are fighting the Allied Peacekeepers, and thus need the stealth and trick tactics to prevail. Given, in game-play the Confederates are not all about stealth, but its a core part of the faction's identity to be the most sneaky, tricky faction in Paradox. (Personally I use little stealth with them.)

lol, "stealth is not the look they're going for" xD

Infact it's EXACTLY what they're going for

Not the look they're going for? That's exactly what they're trying to do!

The wiki even says: "[The Confederates] feature underhanded abilities and stealth gameplay to promote guerrilla warfare tactics."

Now, I admit, there's nothing better than a good Minuteman rush. But stealth really is the name of the game.

Eh, they are kind of both.

You can win with the Confederates without ever using stealth- its just an option, really.

its a option yes but in the grand plan they typical the sneaky buggers

the idea Galgus really is that they are supoused to be so weak early game they gotta hide before they gain the uppgrades, and then get out to fight, or they will be very cost ineffecient. Thats exactly not how it turned out in the alpha-beta mod.

I'm not so sure that is the idea, they seem to be made with good rush capability.

Given, you won't be doing a tank steamroll early on and will need to rely heavily on Infantry and support.

I think they are both just options- rush with their strong Infantry and support vehicles, or try to wait it out till your machines are upgraded enough to steamroll the enemy.

I think Minutemen aren't really that cost-effective on their own, but the support options boost that ratio.

Galgus that mainly becasue of the ore collecter and imbalance that happened in the mod e.g other factions have no snipers

I'll admit that the Transport Truck with a Sniper in it (and any fireport vehicle/aircraft with a Sniper in it) seems overpowered, but its well possibly to pull off a good rush without it. The problem is that its kind of invalidating other support options because it has that much power.

Snipers in fire port vehicles are the bane of infantry in every game where they exist (anyone remember Pathvees or Rocketvees in Generals?). The fact that a faction can pull it off in the first place should make the faction's snipers less cost efficient when alone (for example by higher pricing or worse statistics) OR disable the range bonus for snipers in transports for ALL snipers.

I remember the Pathfinder Humvee. I used to build about 3 to to protect entire armies from any amount of infantry, including commandos as PathVees detected stealth. I also remember the KellVee and the Kellcycle. Not often used, and certainly not as powerful or as easy to get as the PathVee, but still insane.

I'm both for and against this. All units should be competitive in the only thing they do(like snipers) so they shouldn't be less cost-effective merely because they're supposed to be used with a fireport transport. Why not just turn the transport into a sniper buggy in that case?

So I guess I'm for all snipers being severely nerfed when in fireport transports. Maybe can only fire while stationary and don't get a range bonus?

well, snipers already can't fire when they are moving, and they are still OP

KamuiK wrote: Snipers in fire port vehicles are the bane of infantry in every game where they exist (anyone remember Pathvees or Rocketvees in Generals?). The fact that a faction can pull it off in the first place should make the faction's snipers less cost efficient when alone (for example by higher pricing or worse statistics) OR disable the range bonus for snipers in transports for ALL snipers.

The Allies Multicopter will be infinitely more scary.

I generally don't think its a good idea to let a faction do something like that.

I don't really see the value Snipers add to game-play: they are borderline OP without any support against Infantry, but with it become infantry invalidators.

Yeah, we handled snipers poorly early on. Fortunately, we have time to balance them for reals now, with the Krait Sniper as our test subject.

open_sketchbook wrote: Yeah, we handled snipers poorly early on. Fortunately, we have time to balance them for reals now, with the Krait Sniper as our test subject.

They should at least harm an enemy by 1/3 of their health bar every time they shoot, depending on the Sniper anyway.

Edited by: Protroid

surely snipers need time to take a shot. like a long waiting time before the can fire. so that proper micro can do wounders against unprepared armys. but thats just my idea. not: Run-stop-fire-run. more like: Run-stop-aim-fire-run.

I have to agree with igncom1, thats how it should be, thats how it makes sense.

the fact that infantry in many games can't shoot while moving, but yet reload, and that high powered ones are kept balanced with slow RoF have caused balancing problems in so many games. Remeber in RA2? The sniper had an extremly long reload time and very slow speed to balance it.

Perhaps snipers should simply have a (much) longer reload time as it would take more time to aim from a moving vehicle or maybe a setup time so that there is a chance to attack the vehicle before the snipers take a shot.

On the topic of PAWI technology the Confederates are supposed to have a method of ingenuity to their vehicles and renovation (so in this case GAP is being improved on) so its understandable that they would have some sort of improved tech.

Edited by: norm0616

Snipers should need a little preparation time as Ingcom1 suggested. Sniper goes into position, waits shortly, then (s)he can fire. Slow unpack and packup time and/or low speed and maybe a very slow RoF. The possibilities are there.

Long Packup and unpack times dont make for a slower RoF if the snipers are stationary for a long time. Which is good because its the idea of a sniper really. Not to Hit n' run (maybe for assasins but in RA3 there isnt much to assasinate.) but to defend choke points. (Pathvees are so much fun to use.)

I like the fire delay idea, it takes away some of the cheesy hit-and-run usage and gives more incentive to actually use their stealth ability.

Edited by: Galgus