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I never meant our current Bolg version.
I meant the first movie version of Bolg. ;)
Noone in the team likes the movie-Bolg. In the movie he is just a weaker version of Azog without anything special and not more than an orc who serves Mordor.
In the books he is THE leader of the goblins who united all the tribes to attack the lonely mountain and has nothing to do with Mordor.
We will stay with the book version,as we like the version better and it gives us much better ways to include him. (additionally we all like the old Bolg model much more than the model which is used in the movies^^)
The name of the object was always hall of warrior, even when it was able to finish the campaign. But as said (I think about every day in the last two weeks^^):
This is fixed for the next version.^^
Because they have many more positive sideeffects. Yes, they can be killed with single target abilities which is a disadvantage, but the troups are a bit stronger for their price than the units of other factions.
Additionally you can always use some of them without troups and if you're fighting you can choose which units you want to counter the enemy - other factions can't do that.
Additionally those units are more or less forced to fight for the witchking... therefore they are fighting for him as long as there is the thrall master, but if he is away... they don't fight. (that's how I always imagined it in normal rotw... and why they die? Well... 1.) It's the simpliest way to show that they won't fight for you anymore. xD 2.) Perhaps the witchking cursed them so that they will all die when they try to run away?^^)
As you might have noticed the last pictures were uploaded AFTER version 3.8.1 is released. You can just play 3.8.1, while all the last news were called "Road to 4.0" an the available version is calle "edain 3.8.1".
They are called so, as they show you what will be integrated in the next version of the modification. That is why some of the units have a different look. ;)
The bug with the barracks is known and will be fixed in the next version.
You have to build Sauron (the necromancer) and level him up. (he gets xp when the nazgul or the mouth kill enemies)
At level 3,6 and 9 you can choose one domain.
The icon explains the system of mordor. (for example this sauron system^^)
I don't really know what abilities you're talking about. Probably you're talking about the hero submod (as hoho has said).
This submod is amde by another modder, who has the persmission to create mods for our mod. We don't give any support for the submod, as it is just allowed by us, but otherwise it is independent from our work.
Hmm... that's curious, everything works fine for me.
Perhaps try our other download on our german mainpage:
Try to redownload the mod, probably your downloaded version is broken.^^
There is quite a good Isengard-map in the edain mod. :P (it's called Isengart(verfluckt) and is for 3 players.)
94 No, technically probably impossible.
95 don't know. But we aren't changing much in wotr for the next version. Afterwards we're probably changing some parts of it, but 4.0 will be mostly skirmish changes.
96 If it would be higher the battles would be very boring and difficult to balance. Additionally we don't focus much on ships, but perhaps there will be some minor changes.
97 What do you mean?
98 Scatha will remain at the same place as in the current version. You can build him on a special map, but not on every map.
99 There will be shipbuilding (as written in an update), but the AI won't use transport ships. That is very diffcult (or even impossable) to program.
You don't really have to fight with him. In the current version you can let him stay at your fortress and let the nazgul and the mouth fight. Sauron gains experience when they kill enemies. (no matter if he is near to them or not)
We are working on a lot of stuff which is still missing. Lorien is a part of it, yes.
You can build Mumakil in the current version. You have to train Suladan and summon the mumak pit.^^
I don't know, but I don't think so. (perhaps gates, but walls would look a bit silly.^^)
No. trebuchets would be a lot of work, as we would also need complete new animations and Bfme is quite a fast game and if you'ld always have to build up your siege machine it wouldn'T fit into the game flow. We are fine with the current catapults. Perhaps trebuchets will be integrated at some time, but I doubt it.^^
You're doing nothing wrong - it's a bug in the campaign. (some things were changed in the mod, f.e. the bulding which can be constructed by the builder. As the task still wants you to build the old barracks model you can't win this missio)
We have fixed this for the next version.
The problem is that your comments doesn't look like feedback. Mostly they sound "You are doing everything wrong, I know exactly what you should do and what you are doing even though you haven't told anything about the beta yet and you should do everything I say. When I say 'a' then it is an acceptable reason, but when you say 'a' then it is complete nonsense."
I think that's the problem with most of your comments. You just seem like a sauron fanboy who wants him to be totally overpowered and can't accept that we won't make such a hero so overpowered.
9.) No, I'm not insulting you. But I have the feeling that you're not reading my comments and don't accept that there are more important things than just the lore, when you're creating a game.
And you can't directly compare the different fights, I just used those parts to show you that just because someone belongs to a stronger (or higher) race it doesn't automatically make him stronger or better or anything. There are always persons from lower races who can beat the beings of the upper race.
Sauron feared that Aragorn could unite all the kingdoms, but he also feared the sword. He remembers what the sword has done once and fears the sword.
We don't butcher the lore - there is no fact that Sauron would easily kill Aragorn. Those direct matchups are never really described in the lotr, therefore we can't know how it might have ended. I personally also would NOT say that Aragorn is just an ordinary man.
It seems as if only you have problems with that, noone else thinks that this is a problem. So do you really think that it is such a big problem? I personally don't think so and I think that it even fits much better to Tolkien's spirit this way. And Sauron is NOT as overpowered as you want him to be. He is strong, yes. But we know nearly nothing about his dueling-power. Perhaps he just killed all the heroes at the battle of the last alliance because they stood side by side and had no chance to dodge the attacks? We don't know, we can just assume.
Gondor and Rohan (both factions with walls) were EG factions which needed map control in the first 10-15 minutes. If Mordor or Isengard manage to stay even until the 15 minute mark, the good factions were screwed. All factions should be offensive, every faction should have the possibility to win and you can't win by sitting in your castle and wait for the enemy to attack. To win a game you always have to be the aggressor. If a faction has always map control it will always win, as you will always have more money.
4.) As said again: You haven't played the new version, but of course: I will always put my catapults in front of your towers, so that they can attack them. Catapults have longer range than towers and with your orcs around the catapults you have to fight your way through them and can't destroy everything in a small rush. And as said... Sauron will kill all those troups then.
5.) No, he wasn't completely powerless. Read the books. He still had some power. (and enough magic inside of him to contaminate the area of his death. But even when you don't consider Saruman: What about Smaug? He also belongs to a much stronger race than Bard, but still he died against him.
6.) Well, I personally don't remember that he just sneak up and pushed him. He fought him and then pushed him back. You're saying he is lucky... but if I say that Gil-Galad was unlucky (which is EXACTLY the same point) it is wrong... but your point is right? ;) Do you notice something?^^
7.) Thanks for mentioning Feanor... :) He is another prime example for my points. A man of a lower race can be better than someone from a higher race. And just because an elf can do more than other elves doesn't make him anything better. He is still just an elf. A strong elf, yes, but still an elf.
8.) Of course not in the game. Remember the things I wrote you about gameplay and balance? ;) If you read them again and think about it you will notice the problem in your thoughts.
1.) Yes, he is free, but there are more resources than the normal costs... time is also a very important resource in the game and your army are also resources. When you have to take all your army to a single spot, all of your resources are there. The enemy can split up his army and use only a small amount of his resources to force all of your resources on a single spot. While you fight there he can easily attack the rest. After the fight you need a lot of time to rebuild your army, while Mordor doesn't need this time. That are also resources in the game...
All these different resources have to be considered in the game. And you say: "Let's make the balance even worse!"
2.) Yes, I'm bringing catapults in the discussion as you can't just take one single part of a faction, you always have to consider everything of the faction, best example is galadriel:
She is totally overpowered, but noone uses her. Why? because she doesn't fit into the faction. You always have to consider the combinations which are possible.
And yes: Gondor can build catapults... But:
(a) Mordor can spam much more catapults
(b) The catapults of Gondor won't help you defending your castle, as they can't attack the catapults outside of the castle when they are IN the castle.
3.) Gondor is a bit stronger in EG atm, that is correct, but Mordor should be able to survive. And we have told you a few times, but you are doing the same mistake again...
You have NOT played the beta. You DON'T know how the balance is there. You just know a few things. You are just saying: "Everything is staying the same, just the buildings are limited." Do you really believe that this is the way we're doing it? I told you a few times that there will be many more huge changes to the balance. You can't say anything about the balance in version 4.0, as you can't compare it to the balance of 3.8.1 and you haven't played the game.
And I won't discuss with you about gameplay. Have you ever played Bfme I?
Afaik hoho should be right.^^
We don't plan a major update about the dwarves - we wanted to show you the reworked skins, as we got new material (because of the movies^^) and therefore were able to create better skins. :)
On moddb we show every day one skin and afterwards we're just writing a small update on our german website which shows all of the skins together, but nothing more. As said we are working very hard on the balance atm, therefore it is difficult to show you many things. Of course we could tell you:
"Gondor soldiers got 50 health more... and now 25 less again... and now 50 more but 10% less damage... and now 20 health less and 20% more damage..." :P
But I think noone would like such updates. :D
We haven't integrated the dwarves into the new balance system yet, but probably they will get a bit weaker. They will probably always have more health than the average hero, just because they are dwarves. :P As far as I remember most abilities of the dwarve remain (perhaps some little tweaks here and there).^^ We'll see if those abilities are too strong in the new versions or not. Of course we try to make a good balance.^^ Therefore (and for less bugs xD) we got some more beta- and balance-testers. We have more balance- and beta-testers than we ever had before.^^
"Real" Fans should also know this. And a world where the evil person is unkillable doesn't really fit into this, therefore Sauron is not unkillable. Additionally Tolkien used many parts of the edda for his lotr-mythology. And there noone was perfect, everyone had weaknesses and sometimes weak persons managed to defeat strong persons.
Therefore it is much closer to Tolkien's idea when there is no unit who can't be countered. :)
And as you might have read before (because I have written it many times in the past few days):
ALL heroes are weakened in the next version. So all of your points against Aragorn etc. can be neglected. Additionally Aragorn can be killed easier than Sauron, as he can only kill some troups when he has his army of the dead ability ready. But as soon as it is on cooldown... well, no chance. Sauron instead has his enormous melee attack which has no cooldown.^^
Finally I have to say again: You are always just arguing with the lore, but as this is a book we have to consider much more different aspects. Sometimes we have to make compromises, as the game would otherwise be very bad.
8.) The last time I checked Gothmog won, that's correct, but he also needed a lot of time and he got injurys in that fight. And why should Sauron kill Aragorn within a few seconds, when Melkor had no chance to do the same with Fingolfin in a few seconds?
And what is with Luthien? Her magic was also stronger than Melkor's (at least in some areas) but still she was "just" an elf, while Melkor was a Vala.
9.) Why should he still be able? Sauron already had problems with fighting lesser beings while Melkor was still alive. In the third age he probably had less power than in the first age.
Sauron was a strong fighter, yes. But not unbeatable. And yes, Aragorn can be killed by a single orc. But now look at my lost group of comments and read the gameplay and balance part again. ;) Those are VERY important parts of a game, as you can stick very close to the lore, but still have a ****** game. You always have to look at the gameplay and balance, otherwise the game is very frustrating and noone wants to play it.
10. Read the whole sentence, not only a part of it. ;) I said "Perhaps". Tolkien never wrote anything about it, but he also never said: "Sauron was a total badass. Without problems he just fought against Gil-Galad and all the other heroes and killed them with a fart. No hero had a chance to survive more than 1 second when he fought against Sauron."
So you're saying that you are a "real" tolkien fan and I'm no real Tolkien fan?
Most of the things you said show me the opposite. There is more than just the books, Tolkien had survived the great war and he wrote the lotr as he wanted to handle the memories. That was one of the reasons, of course there were some more important reasons (f.e. the elvish language).
Same as above. And you said that Aragorn can't kill Sauron. ;) Therefore (and because he can be easily protected with orcs) he is a sure win, as he can destroy everything and let the catapults destroy the walls without giving the other player a chance to react.
5.) No, he wasn't completely powerless. He has lost most of his power, but not everything.
That orc wasn't in the books, that is correct. (believe me or not, but I have read them and know what happens in the books ;) )
But it is a very good symbol for Tolkien's lore.
Even the strongest beings can be killed by small creatures. And even the smallest people can change the outcome of a battle. one of Tolkien's most important topics in lotr was that there can be very strong and powerful persons, but all of them can be defeated by small and weaker persons. Everyone can change something and the important and strong ones can't be sure to survive everything.
I know it because Tolkien himself wrote it. He wrote that Gandalf would have ended there and Gandalf himself already knew that he couldn't defeat them all. (this was written in the book)
And just because he can kill a Balrog doesn't mean that he can win against many wargs and orcs... How do you know what the magic of Gandalf is like? Tolkien always tried to make a subtle magic and not gigantic fireballs.
Yeah and who managed to make him fall? ;)
8.) Yes, Fingolfin was a normal elf. He was a king, but still a normal elf. Faramir and Boromir are also just normal humans. They may be strong for their race but still: they just belong to the race and are nothing higher.
Fingolfin was a strong elf, but Aragorn was also a very strong Dunedain. (imo stronger than his ancestors, as he managed to fight against the ring)
Let's move on to the spells you listed... what happens if the Mordor player gets sauron before someone has such high tier spells? This can happen. Then you're basically ****** up. Additionally there are a lot of factions which don't have spells which are strong versus heroes. So they don't have a chance if we'ld be using spells as counter. It is important that the counter is available as soon as the countered unit can be on the battlefield. This is also very difficult for spells, as you can't really combine the money, the spell points and the luck of a player so that you can always have the counter. (otherwise again: very bad and frustrating gameplay)
Therefore: Spells are no good idea.
" A huge army "
Same as heroes - additionally you can easily protect sauron against most damage with your orcs. A hero should have a counter beside of "a 10 times stronger and more expensive army".
As you might have noticed I have played the mod since version 1.0 and have noticed most of the things in the mod. Sauron doesn't have so much health, as he was totally overpowered before. He killed everything without dying. But if he would have more resistance versus heroes it would be very similar to giving him more health. As said above a fortress with towers is NO counterplay, as the space where the towers can be build is very limited and if sauron can give the player complete mapcontrol a simple fortress won't stop the player. And clmibing walls... hahaha... We've got our clown hat today, do we? As I have written above walls and towers are no problem as soon as you have mapcontrol. When someone can kill everything beside of a fortress he is still overpowered as you hvae other units who can easily destroy the walls afterwards.
You still haven't said anything against most of my points. And everyone interprets the books of tolkien in a slightly different way. "True" fans (as you have used this phrase) know that there is much more in the lotr than just the written words which you can read.
But now to the answer for your points:
"All Gondor heroes combined?"
To say it in your words: "I hope you are joking".
I have already answered this point. Just read the gameplay section of my last comment. If you have to combine all heroes, Sauron would always have a huge advantage, as the Mordor player can just build Sauron and afterwards the Gondor player always needs more resources AND probably even looses more money throughout the fight. Therefore the mordor player will always have a win after the fight, no matter what he is doing. This is something which is very bad for all kind of games. You always need a counter for a hero which is not much more expensive, as the game will be completely imbalanced otherwise. Every unit should be countered by another unit (or combination of units) which costs less.
And arrow towers... really?
So you can just build 3-4 catapults and destroy them. As you also have sauron (who can easily kill everyone) the enemy can't attack the catapults without losing much more money. Therefore arrow towers are no good counter for a hero. He would be able to destroy everything and afterwards the enemy player has no chance, as he can't come out of his castle and you can siege him without any problems.
I personally love to play star wars battlegrounds (a very old game - aoe I meets star wars :P)
and stronghold (the first one and crusader).
The other rts I like to play are already named.^^ (aom, aoe II, bfme, warcraft)
If you're also thinking about some games which take place in the modern time (of in the future), I also like command and conquer (all cnc until cnc 3... cnc 4 is ******^^), empire at war and world in conflict.
If Sauron would be able to kill heroes, how could you kill him? He could just run into your base and destroy everything without any counterplay. That's a boring gameplay, as you don't have to think about your doings. Additionally it is very bad for the balance, as you always need to invest much more money than his normal price into killing him. Therefore buying sauron and attacking would ALWAYS be a win for Mordor, which would also be stupid. (you can do it over and over again and you always know that you are killing more than you are loosing)
Therefore for Gameplay and for Balance it is better when he can be countered. And if a hero is strong vs heroes, he has to kill heroes which cost more than he, otherwise he would be useless.
And as I (and some users) already said:
Saruman was killed by wormtongue, Gandalf (in the movies) nearly by a normal orc.(pippin saved him)
If the eagles wouldn't have saved Gandalf, he would also have died in the hobbit.
Gothmog (also a Maia in the first age) was killed by an elf. Normal elves also managed to fight against Morgoth. So why shouldn't a dunedain be possible to fight against a Maia?
Yes, in earlier days Sauron managed to fight against those heroes, but we don't if Aragorn has a different fighting style aor gil-galad just had bad luck or something like that. There are dozens of reasons why Aragorn could be able to fight against Sauron. (and btw: Sauron feared Aragorn.^^)
Finally as I have already said:
We can't just take all things from the book and add them exactly in the game. The gameplay and balance would be horrible. We always try to be as close to the book as possible, but we also have to consider other things as this is a game.
Before I start the "main" post:
I personally would say that Mordor stomps Gondor. All gondorian heros and troups can be killed easily with many catapults and archers. (and the usual orc spam)
And do you really think that we are just doing some change without looking at the rest?...
You haven't even tested the game yet and still you think that you know exactly what the balance is like.^^ The whole balancesystem will be changed, the countersystem will be reworked, just nearly everything will change.
And Gandalf's price will be less, that's correct... but do you really believe that we are just reducing the price without taking him some of his poer? Most heroes atm are very strong (too strong) and we don't like such abilities which one **** all units. (even though some of them are balanced... it's just not fun to play against it)
Therefore all the heroes will also get changed.
So why do you think that mordor's heroes will be nerfed, but gondor's heroes are untouched?
And I already told you that orcs will also probably be strengthened.
Therefore all of your points int he two lists can be neglected.
Perhaps you should start to read what I have written before I have to tell the same things again and again and again...
And I have already told you about the aragorn vs sauron thing:
This is a game. We can't just use all things one to one in the game.
We always have to consider many things:
(and much more)
We also told you that even normal people can kill Maia. Tolkien always tried to be as realistic as possible, therefore even people like Sauron and Gandalf can be killed by normal humans, even by humans like Denethor.
You mean which ring-gandalf you'll get?
Nope, Gandalf is not random, Saruman is random.
If you have Gandalf the grey, he'll become Gandalf the corrupted and if you have Gandalf the white he'll become Gandalf the blessed.