3D Space RTS fan. Searching for life outside the homeworld :)
Many of HW2 modeller are used of making some straight lined ships. But this is wrong: for example, look at the shape of the Sajuuk-ship: it looks like curved knife. The HW Universe is the universe of curved knifes, not the straight ones.
Actually, I was thinking about how can Makaan cult save itself? Very easily - The new paradigm would be taken - that he forced the events making bentusi to reviel the event. So he was the actor of the Sajuuk. Something like Buddhism's “Bodhisattva” who’s actions cannot be judged by usuall people.
Karan & Makaan could be taken something as Ying-Yang thing: The Great Shiva, Destroyer, Makaan, the Great Beginning, and the Karan, The Saviour, the Vishnu, the Great Continua. Mb, in the HW Universe these are Quaar-Jet & Koshiir-Ra avatars.
Btw, about “khar”.
There are two formed meanings of this: “ship” and the “first”. Both are quite right. But...
1. Kharak - Planet habited by the Exiles
a) "Ship" meaning could be taken not so straight: it could mean smth like "place"; but even without it the planet is quite big ship - for those who had seen only their prison ship for generations, "ship" could have more sacred meaning then we do;
b) Guys translated it smth like "first planet" that was possible to habite;
2. Khar-Selim - Explorer ship;
a) Ship-explorer, very simple )
b) First explorer, smth like this;
3. Khar-Toba - city on the ship ruins;
a) Ship-city; ship-landing or else. Some are taking this name with guidestone - the reflection to the Kaaba in Mekka (Mekka's "brother" is Sajuu-ka, IMHO), the black stone. This is quite corellating, especially if we know that "kara/khara" in turks language is "black";
b) Something like "first city";
4. Kharam - ship wreckages on some mp map;
a) Ship-am )))
b) First-am )) well, we should know smth more about this ship and it's purpose. Mb, it's the first, but... we don't know;
5. Sajuuk-khar - "The Chosen One"
a) The placeholder of the Sajuuk, the “sajuukshipped”; the one who's is lead by Sajuuk, the captain )) So, the ship of the Sajuuk should be named the same - Khar-Sajuuk;
b) The first after Sajuuk?..
There are few more ancient city names with Kar/Khar in it. Like Khar-Nak - egyptian city near the Tanis. ))
And actually I more like "ship" version - it's more like translating from other language, where you have to take two words and to think why they are connected this way and what was meant originally.
Like Sajuuk - One, who's hads shape what it is. I guess there are two words: "shaping" and smth like "universe". But like word "ubuntu" meaning humanity and all the stuff connected with it, this two words are surrounded with meanings. To shape sand/clay with hands (by quaran man is made of clay) and the noun "everything existing".
Like Yahweh - tetragrammaton YHWH - "I am" - words told by Christ answering is he Jesus when guards came to capture him, and also:
quote wrote:The word Yahweh is a modern scholarly convention for the Hebrew יהוה, transcribed into Roman letters as YHWH and known as the Tetragrammaton, for which the actual pronunciation is disputed. The most likely meaning of the name may be “He Brings Into Existence Whatever Exists", but there are many theories and none is regarded as conclusive.
The Kunlun mountains are believed to be the paradise of Taoism. The first to visit this paradise was, according to the legends, King Mu (976-922 BCE) of the Zhou Dynasty. He supposedly discovered there the Jade Palace of Huang-Di, the mythical Yellow Emperor and originator of Chinese culture, and met Hsi Wang Mu (Xi Wang Mu) , the 'Spirit Mother of the West' usually called the 'Queen Mother of the West', who was the object of an ancient religious cult which reached its peak in the Han Dynasty, also had her mythical abode in these mountains.
I've read some article where was said that Russia with nuclear weaponry got the second place in the world after America by it's military potential; and the third - without nuclear weapons - after USA and China.
In HW universe the role of nuclear weaponry plays the Great HS Core.
The Makaan is the incarnation of Genghis Khan as the conqueror, the lie-prophet Mohammed, and the vaygr are somelike asians, chinese (if we take modern history).
Taiidanies - russians (if we take modern history) and some eastern despoties: Egypt, Persia (B.C.), China Impire (there was a historical thread on relic forums, where was told that original kushani - that ones that are counted as turani people - flee from the borders of China to the borders of modern Iran - I might be not correct, but you've understood the main idea).
Hiigarians incarnate USA & Israeli, maybe, by tech - USA, by count - Israel (both modern and ancient history).
So, I'm leading to the dick comparisson ))) Whos army would be most dangerous:
1) with HS, vaygr would be the 1st; hiigarians - the 2nd; and the taiidanies are 3rd (mb, 2nd too - they are not so mobile, but are numbered);
2) without HS, vaygr still are the first; taiidanies - the 2nd; and hiigarians - the 3rd.
But of course, it's quite hard to say... As we take hiigarians as one of the most advanced fleets in HW universe, then taiidanies has almost nothing to change. And this correlates with reality: B-52 flying fortress is flying for... 60 years already? The russian army is also modernizing, but still a lot of things remains the same. Well, i've told it already here:
Mkey, they could have more stuff, especially of recoinassance, spying, slipgate and trade ways controlling, but this is not the combat stuff, not the regular fleet, but special units.
And the hiigarians - are also quite small empire. Yes, they have advanced fleet, they have the core, they have very qualified miliitary personal with every citizen duty to serve the Uncle Sam Aunt Karan before going into adult life, but still can their military potential be compared with Frerrn Agregate? With taiidani?.. Not so much known...
Anyway, you can think of it yourself ) :P
P.S.: another one comparisson, that was made during "Omega Project", is: vaygr are zergs, hiigarians are protoss, and taiidanies are terrans )
Those who track me lately must have understood that I'm doing some sh* with taiidanies.
So, the point is that I have a dream of making homeworld2 3rd race, that would be canonical and big enough to be competitive with H & V - and these are Taiidanies. And I want recreate it.
Of course, there already was taiidani recreations - in FXmod, in HWU, but I didn't liked it, because they were trying to fit HW1 system to HW2 system, but HW2 sys is very different, so they must be implemented from scratch, with only very few elements remained from HW1.
I was asking for the model to them, but everyone refuse, except BloodFleet (I hope he's still in a good mood to allow his model using )). Then I had to write my bachelor paper, and the whole thing broke out.
But the dream remained. And I still want to see taiidani in HW2. Actually, by making HW2TP, I want to create standard de-facto. Not only in research/building but also remodelled.
Being shorter, there are few threads left:
Actually, I'm not a modder, not working with HW2 engine, but I'll post all my diagrams with pictures related to the project in a divided mod, hoping that there will be men who would like to continue the way I'm thinking.
But now I have to make pictures for the development group, and for the mod itself, also the "greeting" text. It won't be good pictures, but they are asked here ))
I'm in doubts.
There are platforms and utility ships.
By HW2 division, there are turrets and Vaygr HS Gate Generator. If we take taiidani ships, these are Defenders, of course.
But! HS Gate Generator - could this be the utility ship? It's very easy to decide, as this ship acts like a usual platform: is deployed and stays on one place. But in case of taiidani (at least as I was thinking them), there are no these ships: every one is movable infinite time.
So, except defenders there are more "strange class" ships:
0. Research Ship;
1. Sensor Array;
2. EW-ship; (ex-defence fighter); (EW- Electronic Warfare);
3. GW Generator;
4. Cloak Generator;
EW-ship could be moved to the fighters again, given extra-life and 3 ship squad, but it's not a fighter. Defence fighter was tactical ship, now it's becoming strategical like probe. We can move it to the other sensors: probe, proximity, sensor array... It would fit quite good among repair & wrack-salvage ship... But if they have corvette early drive, then this ship - fighters latest drive... If we talk about defenders - they don't even need fighter chassis to be developed, the defence fighter is also not like fighter looking...
The same thing with generators: vaygr have generator in platforms. If we look at at taii, their generators are made on some capital ship drive - got same structure with r.collector's drive. Also the r. ship & sensor array is made on the base of some "old subfrigate hull". And they all play the role of modules: research/ sensors array (3 sensors at once)/ GW Gen/ Cloak Gen. But - generators.
And I don't want to make crossclass researches. But I want to make it quite HW2-style classified, and be logic at one time.
What would you advice?..
Mkey... As we can't make the original defence fighter, I've decided to give it the sensor distortion ability, and to move it to the platform class, as it's won't be the battle vessel, and in platform class there is defenders - originally the same class ships )
But now I'm thinking of the possibility to give the ECW-ship scout sensor range (8-9k), as the taiidans have no scouting ships: light interceptor is fast as hell, but still is an interceptor. Of course, there is Sensor Array, but it's too slow and is playing the role of advanced sensor module attached to the bigger ship.
Only one thing makes me curious: how it is combined - sensor distortion & advanced sensors?..
As far I know, there are active & passive sensors; Active Sensors send signal, and check the reflection, Passive - are catching the active sensor signals... Smlike cognitive dissonans.
How do you think?..
There is a kiith Liir-Hra, actually, one of the fatefull kiith in kushani hiistory )
As was told in HW1 manual & HWC apocryphas (stories about Liir-Hra & Kaalel kiithid), Liir-Hra was the vassal of the Hraal, industrial kiith. Arban Liir-Hra, the first kiith-sa of the separated Liir-Hra, managed to get his kiith freedom only by a miracle. And by the money of Manaani-sa.
They became space exploration kiith. Probably because of them the cosmic era started on Kharak, the MS launch, the destruction of Kharak and so on and so on...
HW2 gave us the new Liir-Hra name - Malketh Liir-Hra, which said some epic speech before going into 1,5k+ year hegira ("The Hegira: There and Back Again"; "Lord of the Cores: The Trinity of the Cores"; "LotC: The Two Flagships"; "LotC: Return of the Sajuuk").
PAIN & ENSLAVEMENT
Hearing the name Malketh LiirHra at first time is quite surprising. That's because of the fact, that we've learned about the LiirHra kiith only from the HW1-HWC manual: they've came from Hraali people. And as we know, the kiithid came out of the hegira: the devision to the kiithid happened there (the word itself is taken from Poul Anderson book, where was the Kith, a persecuted starfaring civilization; the "HOMEWORLD" itself is a collection of science fiction stories: "Hyperion", "Dune", "BSG" etc + Moses story, going from the Egypt). So it's hard to understand why the Liir-Hra kiith representative was before the exile.
But let's look at the situation from the other sight. Was it possible to move all the billion people from the planet? I think - NO. If we look at the situation from the real world examples, we can see that always been that the government, dissidents flee off the country, the usuall people remain where they are. Even the big emigration is far lesser than the people remaining.
So, when the taiidani came to hiigara with ultimatum to move away that was referring to the people who was guilty in Taii Emperor's death. They were given a chance to move away. And these were the goverment, their families, aristokracy: being shorter, all the people who felt that they would be killed in Taii Order, and all the people who felt that they won't be able to live under Taii dictatorship, to give the oath to the new Emperor; and the supporters: like religious people (btw, it gives a good explanation, why taiidani could also believe in Sajuuk: like greek teachers learned roman children olympic gods, the Stayers learned the taii Sajuuk - and Hiigara was a capitol of Taiidani Empire now).
We can see, that the exiles were tempted in politics. So was no surprise that they started dividing even in such harsh conditions. The LiirHra family supporters, the Gaalsi famiily... As the son is not always the good continuer of the father doings (or the daughter - mothers? btw this feature was also taken from the jews, as by their tradition the groom goes to the brides house, and the nationality is given by mother; I don't know whether matriarchy is basic Hiigarian feature, or it's grown in the prison ships, or was some kind Kharak developed - like dark matriarchy times were enlighted with unwaited tech growth from Nabaali so the matriarchy left, and the men were fighting for their rights :) ) the fraction were floating in popularity chart :), slowly forming the existing kiithid system.
This continued on the Kharak, when the harsh exsistance forced the family to play bigger role then it was before, thus making the knowledge to be saved, controlling the population growth, and saving the power of "chosen" centuries back...
JOIN US OR DIE
There was a funny moment in HW2 beginning: was told that the taii have JOINED the vaygr.
For me it's quite nonsense. Of course, the original HW/HWC script writer wrote a book where Russian & China have made united country (this script is one of the usual stupid beliefs about Russia, among the "bears walking in the cities" and balalaika, vodka, ushanka, perestroika), but he made the Taiidani Republic exist.
If we take the vay-gr as the chinese, and the taiidani as Soviet, now russians, does it make sence? Okey, for somebody - yes, but not for russians. These are two very different cultures. It's more likely that Russia joines the EU than the China, that already is hardly believable. I guess, the West simply misses that old understandable Cold War enemy. The China and the Islamic countries are quite chaotic, and it's unclear how to fight with country that makes you rich (low cost production), or with the religion, that calls it's zealots to conquer the infidels and denies all the Western values. The Soviet was so simple )
The same goes here: after these words I felt like V & T had such of a conversation:
- Hey, guys! Where are you going?
- To Hiigara!
- Oh, yeah? Take us with you!
Another one absolute evil. As the Taii Emperor, as the Turanic Raiders, as the T-Mat, as the Beast...
But okey. Actually, these words were the official Hiigarian propaganda. Like every country, it has the official position to this and that question, and tries to convince it's people that it is true - to make it easier to manipulate. It's not always bad, but usually it's not good. Like "everybody lies" (c) Dr. Haus.
Let's remember what happend when the Exiles returned from the Hegira. They did - what? - the same thing that the taiidans made with them. And again I really doubt that they could make the billion population world (the capitol of the Taii Empire!) disapper. They really did the same thing with the taiidanies, just more cruel.
They haven't let go the ones who were guilty of Kharak massacre. They made the taiidans - the ones that came from the other taii worlds, and the ones that were hiigarian descendants - the citizens of the 2nd sort (like it happened with russians in post-soviet republics), thus building the "Golden Billion" system and following the Siidim way - dividing people into pure and unpure gritiidims...
Of course, this circumstance was quite annoying to the new Taiidani Republic and it's people, but they needed this "formal non-aggression and co-operation pact" and further in-law relationships for normal existance in Galactic Council. But still, after the threat of the taii imperialists has dissappeared, everybody remembered that taiidani were empire once! And they could do it one more time! Especially, as many lords of taiidani empire assembly were presented in Republic government. So, no matter how tried, taiidans were bad...
So when the Makkan came, he said - "join us or die", and the taii imperialists agreed, as they were too weak fo resist, and Makaan really represented their forgotten claim for Hiigara and Emperor. But the republicans were fighting - they had what to loose, but they could not resist the uberlong hyperspace jumps of Makaan fleet: while they were gathering fleet at one point, he was far away. And I think he made the same trick with taiidani, as the the taiidani made with Kharak: he said "give up, or I will destroy the Taiden"...
And thus came out that the the taii have JOINED the vaygr...
But let's return to the Liir-Hra kiith.
The HW1 manual told that the mainly all the kiithid believed in Sajuuk. Just every - in special way. With additional gods or special conditions.
I don't know how is spelled this word - Hra - but it could be reference to the Amun-Ra religion (like "Kharak" - to Kharak city; Tiir - to Tir etc) and other heliocentric religions, believing that the sun is God. The sun plays very big role in creating life, especially in conditions of the Kharak, with it's boiling water equator.
Usually pagans don't like when their gods get checked or doubted (like the greek philosof Anaxagor in 5 century BC was exiled because he told that the sun is not Gelios but the fireball), but in the technical revolution age, started by Nabaali winning over Gaalsi, Liir-Hra could wanted to understand what are believing in, to get closer to their God, to get some proof.
Of course, the astronomical researches forced them to change the paradigm of their belief: some became atheists, some joined the other "professional" confession with much better elaborated construction of the world...
The Liir-Hra logo could be the sun drawing.
PS: ...or satellite dish...
Was examining HW2 research tree to find some universal numbers for each of the race, made smth like perfect tech-based start for vaygrs and hiigarians... W/o refinery or worker, so this thing is just theoretical )
1. 0 sec - Research Module/Fighter Facility 30/45;
2. 30 sec — Research module built up; Research Corvette Chassis 40; build platform module 70;
3. 45 sec — Fighter Facility built up; building Assault Craft;
4. 70 sec — Corvette Chassis research ended up; Research Lance Beams 25; Build Corvette Facility 60;
5. 80 sec — Assault craft built up; Build next Assault Craft;
6. 95 sec — Lance beams researched up; research fusion bombs 25;
7. 100 sec — platform module built up;
8. 115 sec — assault craft is built up; build lancers/assaulters 35 and platform 20;
9. 120 sec — fusion bombs completed; Select needed tech to research;
10. 130 sec — Corvette facility built up;
2 fighters, 1 building 1 platform, res. module, fighter, corvette module, lancers/bomber tech researched;
1. 0 sec — Research Module+Fighter Facility 75/45;
2. 45 sec — fighter facility is built up; Build interceptors 35; build platform module 70;
3. 75 sec — research module is built up; Build corvette 60 or frigate facility 65 or capital ship facility 75; Research interceptor speed 30;
4. 80 sec — interceptors built up; Build more interceptors;
5. 105 sec — interceptors speed researched up; Research ping 40;
6. 115 sec — platform module built up; interceptors built up;
Build interceptor + platform;
7. 135/140/150 sec — corvette/frigate/capship facility built up;
fighter + x facility; platform module, research module; 2 fighters, 1 fighter building, 1 platform; interceptor speed + ping researched;
Smth like that.
Just found, that there were two Dreadnaught Berth: one for Makaan, one for Karan (in 9th mission one berth was outside the map).
But the ship is one. So I don't get the point - whether there were two Progenitor Motherships, or it's the one part splittered into to two peaces?..
But this is un-fucking-believable: if this is the bug, then it's just fuaKING crazy scripter bug....