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The Mutator Suggestions Thread (Games : Vector Thrust : Forum : Game Types, Goals & Mutators : The Mutator Suggestions Thread) Locked
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Nergal01
Nergal01 We will need PhD in physics degree to play video games in the future.
Mar 16 2013, 7:01pm Anchor
timeSymmetry wrote:@ IbizenThoth that idea for a mutator of performance being affected by damage is excellent. Is very simple, but in a good way.

This can be implemented quickly and very soon.
However about this idea, I believe it works well in skirmish battles, but in real missions it may have several down sides. The idea of unit having weaker performance as a penalty every time it gets more damage is unmistakably a spiral of defeat.
The problem is that most spirals of defeat is that they are far from being entertaining when you are the victim.

But I have a question. What could prevent the player intentionally crash every time he thinks the current damages limits his effectiveness?


Might want to add return line for repair/rearm? However the return line have a cooldown before you can use it again to prevent abusing/camping.

Mar 16 2013, 7:19pm Anchor

The problem is in skirmish (especially in deathmach), death is cheap, and is far easier to just crash than to go to the return line.
One simple thing we could add is -1 kill when crashing.

IbizenThoth
IbizenThoth Gun-crazy
Mar 16 2013, 9:53pm Anchor

Hmmm, thinking about it, I guess that the only real way to prevent a player from becoming overly tired is to provide a convenient method to land and repair, at least for manned aircraft. For UCAVs could probably use a jumping between units type gameplay. I guess that a system of having all allied aircraft available to the player could also work with the jump system.

_________________________________________________

Ah, I hadn't even considered how they'd work for a skirmish battle (for the purposes of this response)! Though I guess that making crashes a simple minus 1 score as you said.

Edited by: IbizenThoth

Nergal01
Nergal01 We will need PhD in physics degree to play video games in the future.
Mar 20 2013, 10:14am Anchor

Limited logistics mutator: As every dynamic campaigns have taught us (?), everyone have limited logistics (which is totally shared for teams), in other words, there's a limited ammo supply which is shared for entire player (if FFA)/team (so that those who use same missile/SPW really have try to conserve ammo). and will be constantly consumed as you and your teammates keep throwing those missiles/SPWs and eventually only leaving your team with nothing but guns once you don't have any missile/SPW in your supply reserves therefore, makes team ammo conservation and careful aiming extremely vital.
Oh and the AI *should* be adjusted to be less spammy and more tactical as well.

Edited by: Nergal01

Mar 21 2013, 1:04pm Anchor

@ V3000TT that seems more suited to be a mutator for campaigns
But the AI already automatically adapts to the amount of ammo they have available, if they sortie with “low” ammo, you will hardly see any trigger-happy.

Nergal01
Nergal01 We will need PhD in physics degree to play video games in the future.
Mar 22 2013, 7:05am Anchor
timeSymmetry wrote:@ V3000TT that seems more suited to be a mutator for campaigns
But the AI already automatically adapts to the amount of ammo they have available, if they sortie with “low” ammo, you will hardly see any trigger-happy.

This one's more geared towards team skirmish, especially to make team ammo conversation extremely important.

Also, to compensate AI's bad habit of crashing the ground: -No/small ground collision mode: Basically makes any plane bounces when it hits the ground, comes in no damage and small damage variant.

midsummersnow
midsummersnow Vector Thrust α/β Tester
Mar 23 2013, 5:42am Anchor
V3000TT wrote:Also, to compensate AI's bad habit of crashing the ground: -No/small ground collision mode: Basically makes any plane bounces when it hits the ground, comes in no damage and small damage variant.

I think the AI should banned from going below 100m from sea leavel to compensate for this.

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Nergal01
Nergal01 We will need PhD in physics degree to play video games in the future.
Mar 23 2013, 5:46am Anchor
Midsummersnow wrote:
V3000TT wrote:Also, to compensate AI's bad habit of crashing the ground: -No/small ground collision mode: Basically makes any plane bounces when it hits the ground, comes in no damage and small damage variant.

I think the AI should banned from going below 100m from sea leavel to compensate for this.


Or give them ability to 'swim' underground? O_o
classic Ace Combat reference

Mar 28 2013, 10:20am Anchor

@ Midsummersnow & @ V3000TT The goal is to make the AI play by the same rules as the player without any cheats and be able adapt to any environment. But what you both suggested is the easy way out, so it is unacceptable.
The AI will be improved in future reports to prevent that. (And also to use special function options).

Nergal01
Nergal01 We will need PhD in physics degree to play video games in the future.
Apr 6 2013, 1:20am Anchor

Head-on mode: Makes every player invincible, the only way to damage each other is by firing missile heads-on, just like what Cipher and Pixy *usually* did.

Apr 7 2013, 9:04am Anchor

Sounds good, but to add that mutator it must be added first in the gameplay the awareness of where the damage was made. This also can be expanded and implemented in the units different defense values for all directions, like for example, being hit head-on deals more damage that being hit from bellow, or a tank has less defense from the sides than from the front.

This definitely will add more depth in the gameplay. For the next update there are still some things remain to be added that are closely related to that part of the code. While it is not 100% guaranteed, there is actually a high possibility that this mechanic and mutator be added in this next update.

IbizenThoth
IbizenThoth Gun-crazy
Apr 7 2013, 3:42pm Anchor

To rip from FlyAwayNow, a Super Contrails mutator and a realistic contrails mutator.

Apr 12 2013, 7:52am Anchor

@IbizenThoth, what is the Super Contrails?
@V3000TT, Head-on mode has been already added, it will be available in this update.

IbizenThoth
IbizenThoth Gun-crazy
Apr 12 2013, 8:45am Anchor

Exaggerated contrails that appear in all conditions, much like the smoke used during airshows.

Nergal01
Nergal01 We will need PhD in physics degree to play video games in the future.
Apr 23 2013, 8:51am Anchor
  • Alternate overdrive mode:

Shamelessly borrowing ideas from Gundam Vs series, every player starts with 0% SP fuel, but SP fuel/overdrive energy can be filled by doing these:
-Hitting/killing enemy unit and vice versa (taking damage/getting killed). You still retain your SP fuel/overdrive energy level after dying instead of resets to default value. For balancing issue, hitting friendlies or intentionally crashing won't give you SP fuel/overdrive energy.
-Only can be activated when (at least) reaches 50%
-Weapons are fully reloaded upon activation
-For most cases, there are two types of overdrive: fighter (higher speed, mobility, weapons rate of fire, and faster lock time but doesn't affect defense) and attacker (more damage per hit and lesser damage received, no side effect on mobility but depletes overdrive energy faster)
Would fit better in this game mode though: Moddb.com

  • Unlimited ammo mode: Ammos are automatically replenished once they're depleted (reload duration depends on weapon). Mostly to prevent 'I have no more ammo therefore I accidentally crashing somewhere else' incidents happening.

Edited by: Nergal01

IbizenThoth
IbizenThoth Gun-crazy
Apr 25 2013, 7:11am Anchor

Two Front War - A mutator that splits aircraft into three teams instead of two.

Nergal01
Nergal01 We will need PhD in physics degree to play video games in the future.
Apr 25 2013, 8:05am Anchor
IbizenThoth wrote:Two Front War - A mutator that splits aircraft into three teams instead of two.

No. amount of team per match should be a separate option IMHO. But in most cases there'll be no more than 4 teams.

Edited by: Nergal01

IbizenThoth
IbizenThoth Gun-crazy
Apr 28 2013, 12:24am Anchor

Ah, true, it would be preferable to make multiple teams a settings option rather than a mutator. I guess while we're at it, it's a good chance to start up a dialogue about what would make for good revisions to Skirmish mode too.

May 26 2013, 4:37pm Anchor

Multiple teams a settings option has been added in the latest update.

IbizenThoth
IbizenThoth Gun-crazy
Jun 22 2013, 7:32pm Anchor

Friendly Fire/IFF Mode?

You can lock onto any aircraft/unit and fire on it, including allies. Allies can be identified by sending out an IFF signal, or by coming close enough to visually confirm them as allies. Identified allies will be blue; known enemies will be green; and unidentified units will be classified as bogeys and will appear white.

In order to identify, you will have a one button IFF function, that puts out a ping to ask other aircraft to ping back if they are friendly, turning all allies blue on your radar and screen for a few seconds. The identified allies that are on radar, but off screen will slowly fade back to white/gray over time, while those in your field of view will remain blue until they have exited your view for more than a certain amount of time. If the friendly enters your FOV before that certain period of time, they will remain marked blue until they have been out of view for enough time to fade. If the enemy does an IFF ping, then you and your allies become aware of the original to send out a ping, and all those who respond. The ID of these aircraft will remain for a few seconds after the ping, and a for those in your field of view (camera looking may or may not allow you to retain enemy identification; aircraft orientation may not be as useful as camera orientation when it comes to IFF). Your allies can send out an IFF ping, and you can choose not to respond, but they will regard you as an enemy until you respond. It will be assumed that each aircraft can remember the hostile/friendly state of the unit they are locked onto, as if they are using the tracking look function.

If you fire upon an aircraft, it and aircraft friendly to it will consider you to be hostile, the same applies if fired upon. A ping or visual identification can revise or confirm this evaluation.

IFF pings will break stealth. Friendlies in stealth aircraft may therefore be hesitant to respond to pings.

To prevent players and AI from requesting pings constantly, there will be a cooldown time on response pings. The player can ping out as much as they want, though it will only result in showing where they are (a taunt?). This could be used by using the ping as a way to attract enemies whom your friendlies (if not pinging back) will then engage the enemies firing upon you (especially useful if playing with stealth aircraft). AI will rarely ask for pings, usually at the start of an engagement, and the end of shooting down another aircraft, as the AI is assumed to know the friend/foe status of the aircraft they are pursuing. Otherwise, aircraft which do not know the status of any other, will ping once. AI do not have to respond to your pings or the pings of an allied AI. They will probably have a value set on how likely they are to respond, with modifiers like aircraft, number of enemies, etc.

In multi-team games, a full team ping will result in an automatic disadvantage for the pinging team, as both opposing teams will most likely attack them first. Conversely, if a player is the only one to ping, and is sufficiently good at dodging missiles, one can use his allies to start in on enemies as they become apparent, which may call for a slider option for "IFF Response Likeliness".

Firing on friendly aircraft without bothering to ping will mean negative points. In campaign, it would probably result in mission failure or negative karma. For example, a pilot who team kills often may have fearful allies that always ping, but lose some fighting effectiveness, due to distraction. It would be interesting if this behavior also happened not only in campaigns, but in the course of a single Skirmish mission as well. If you were especially deviant, you could use this to your advantage, by being in a stealth aircraft and picking off enemies who fire on your allies, while not pinging back, thus preserving your stealth. This way, having bad karma opens up a different play style, instead of resulting in just a bad end. Conversely, if you kill allies after IFF pings come in, but still complete missions, you could be sent into missions alone, like the monster you are.

Morality in games tends to result in sorta whacky forced mechanics a lot, instead of actual choice and diversity of gameplay. (in Dishonored, getting the good end meant that you didn't use most of your crazy mankilling skills; Soldier in ACZero meant that you had to kill roughly equal numbers of neutralized and designated targets).

midsummersnow
midsummersnow Vector Thrust α/β Tester
Jun 24 2013, 5:17am Anchor

Close Range Assault mutator there I said it someone had to.

comenoweverybodyloveditreally

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IbizenThoth
IbizenThoth Gun-crazy
Jun 24 2013, 6:19am Anchor

I thought DFM was okay, though using it as an excuse to railroad the player is not. It was fun and exciting, but I didn't like how I would lose track of where I was on the map.

Jun 24 2013, 7:06pm Anchor

I’ve thought a lot about the Friendly Fire/IFF Mode but I always encountered several problems:

-first, it dramatically slows the action

-From what it tried to visualize this does not add choice much choice to the player, only go blind out try to confirm the IFF, so the end result adds little gameplay value, especially considering it add an additional workload to the player. (it’s like forcing the player be to request permission to fire every time he wants to use a missile)

-in skirmish it would devolve in something like as constantly using the leader boards so see which team belongs each player.

-and in the campaign missions, this mechanic would be completely useless in a second play trough because you would already know the spawn locations of your team and enemies.

@Midsummersnow DFM is actually more a full-fledged feature/mechanic that an actually mutator.

midsummersnow
midsummersnow Vector Thrust α/β Tester
Jun 25 2013, 4:39am Anchor
timeSymmetry wrote:@Midsummersnow DFM is actually more a full-fledged feature/mechanic that an actually mutator.

Afterplaying around with the mutators abit last night I relised that anyone can make a lite-DFM by combining several existing mutators.

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Jun 25 2013, 5:55am Anchor

Really? Then, if you don't mind can you tell me the recipe?

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