Humans, the Cause and Solution to the Death of the Planet Earth Thread

Look at earth, we have built huge brilliant structures, we have made transport routes that allow access to areas unknown. Hell we’ve amassed and destroyed earth so brilliantly we’ve wiped out species.
My problem with it is; Evolution...
Just think if man hadn’t decided to evolve into a lifestyle of housing and proper communication then the world would be bliss in its own special way.
Humans have out evolved themselves, humans have becomes so big headed we see our selves as the mammal that populated and made planet Earth its own. In reality though all we’ve done is destroyed the evolution process of millions of other mammals but cutting off there areas, there lifestyle and changed the course of there lives.
Just think if man hasn’t amassed in buildings and build those transport routes and instead of selfishly destroying earth carries on a hunters lifestyle.

If you look at the smaller picture of a caveman sitting in a freezing cave with bloody animals skins compared to a modern man sitting in his plush office on his PC, it may seem the latter has an advantage. Maybe he does but in my opinion man has taken its own freedom to fight, kill and progress in its savagery and left it’s self-open to the destruction of earth...
The End.

This thread was made on January the 04 - 2002
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Thought : Raping the earth, one tree at a time.

Given the general progression of life on this planet and the way it has developed, I'd say that we're just following our natural course to extinction and making way for the next dominant species.

Unfortunately few are with me when I say that perhaps in the interests of continuing life on this planet, we should (as a species) up and leave to make way for whatever new and interesting things might arise in our absence.

What an honourable cause; to sacrifice one's own for what is yet to come.

Who am I kidding? We all know we're not an honourable species. We're going to stay here and screw over this lump of rock until it can support us no longer, then we'll probably use it as a trash heap. But then again, some really interesting life forms might become dominant over a trash heap (Contrary to Rob Grant and Doug Naylor, I'm inclined to believe that cockroaches would evolve in a few more ways than just size).

See thats what I love about lifeform and evolution. One species trash is another species life support. Sure we may make this a rock of mud and trash but indoing that we help another lifeform flurish and grow - such as cockroaches. Hell in 150million years humans could have left earth and moved to another planet, thus leaving cockroaches to become dominant and become huge

In a way It will balance out and humans egotistical edge and will for survival might just make us a species that survives wherever we may venture.

The way I see it...

Sure, many will say man has made earth lead to it's own destruction. However, man does help the earth evolve on it's own and the same with animals. Many many new species have come to be thanks to man to make up for those we killed off.

It's great that we explored in the early years of life because if we haven't been so smart in the beginning of of human life humans would have evolved differently in groups. Humans evolved together for the most part. Their have been some branched evolutions. Like different "races" like the appearance of an asian person. IF this branching continued I think humans would evolve in to other small different species which would have created more conflict then today. If you don't know what I mean... well, I think that groups of humans would have evolved differently and very rapidly to cope with their environments (creating extreme differances in appearance, height, abilities etc.). Now we have people moving all over the world so I think were starting to evolve together.

Yeah, I think we are a selfish race but this is survival. Theres no such thing as "selfish" in the world survival. I don't see it as a bad thing that we take up most of the planets resources. Thanks to evolution we now need these things (medicine, cooked food, heat, etc.) to live a full 70 years. We are greedy when I put it like that but in order to live we must create lines of communication, construct buildings, produce energy and so on. People say things like "Oh we don't need TV or we don't need large homes or we don't need cars!" but I think that isn't true. It does impact the environment but since we have become so attached to technology and science it is our key to survival.

humanity has just become fascinated with itself. i mean have we progressed as a society much at all really? racism, fear and prejudice still exist, just the tribes today are called nations... America, well actually let's not start THAT particular discussion. but the destruction of earth will not happen. the earth will endure. humans and humanity will come and go but the earth will be still there watching and waiting for the next self-indulgent, self-absorbed life form to crawl out of the soup...

See, why do people say our kind is "self-absorbed" and the alike. Who else is there to look out for? We weren't put on this planet to serve! We are here to survive. If we would (everyone is existance) spend everyday of our lives trying to help other species, trying to protect the planet and so on we would go nowhere. I know I sound selfish but it's the truth. It's the truth because we can't help any other species survive or protect our planet 100% because we aren't that powerful. We don't have that much control. If we did we wouldn't be here today because we'd out kill ourselves. So I say the human race is a race bent on survival and "what's mine, is mine".

- Edited By Some1_Call_911 On Mon 19th, Aug 2002 @ 11:18pm

azzor wrote: Hell in 150million years humans could have left earth and moved to another planet, thus leaving cockroaches to become dominant and become huge

As I said before, there's no way we would ever leave our earth alone.
I would be quite happy to go away and let some other species evolve in my absence, but the rest of humanity doesn't seem to be that selfless. Like 911 said, we lead a selfish existance. The less able to adapt that we become, the less we will be willing as a race to make sacrifices like that.

Some1_Call_911 wrote: Many many new species have come to be thanks to man to make up for those we killed off.

Oh, I don't think so mate. There's quite a few more gone than we have back, and now we have insolent morons thinking about 'bringing stuff back'.

If you look at this planet's history, there's always been a lot of balance. Certain balances seem to support life better than others. The more off kilter the earth ends up, the longer it takes to become stable enough for life on a grand scale.

Some1_Call_911 wrote: Thanks to evolution we now need these things (medicine, cooked food, heat, etc.) to live a full 70 years.

There's a big difference between technology and evolution, you know. In evolutionary terms, we haven't done jack sh** in the last several thousand years. Wanna know why? Technology. Because we have technology, we have less need to adapt, making ourselves more 'rigid' and hence more fragile.

Oh, and I live quite a happy life without TV. I have lived quite a few happy years without a computer, and I've spent some time being happy without electricity. A lot of people reckon they're smart, but really, if they can't cope without a bit of technology, where the hell is their brains and imagination then?

Anyone been paying any attention to that chunk-o-rock that's supposedly going to hit the earth in 20 odd years or something?
Anyone head about any of the fabulous plans to stop that from happening and saving the human race?
Anyone read STARK by Ben Elton?

- Edited By Cheeseness On Tue 20th, Aug 2002 @ 4:07am
- Edited By Cheeseness On Tue 20th, Aug 2002 @ 4:10am

Cheeseness wrote:
Anyone been paying any attention to that chunk-o-rock that's supposedly going to hit the earth in 20 odd years or something?
Anyone head about any of the fabulous plans to stop that from happening and saving the human race?

LOL...
ok, lemme start.
How many times have people prediected the doom of earth and been wrong? Of course 100% of the time or we wouldn't be here right now! I've heard of that but here's the thing. You can't predict a giant rock 100 km wide that's 20 years away moving at a speed so fast. It just can't be predicted. It's way too far to start predicting that this asteroid will hit earth. It's too early. I haven't heard any plans to stop this thing but I bet they are quite odd ideas. I've seen the Simpsons and the rocket vs. the asteroid didn't work lol. Well, I just don't think it will even come close to hitting earth. The way I see it, If we were going to be wiped out in the future it wouldn't be by some large rock...

Firstly, to start off, I'd like to say, if there were another species to lead the world, instead of humans, I would want ants to. As mentioned by azz0r, we are a very selfish race, and that has a few benefits, but I think it has more disadvantages, such as slowly destroying this lovely planet. Ants on the other hand, they are not selfish at all. Has anyone ever seen a good ant documentary? It's just amazing how they work - absolutely amazing...I am always baffled by how well the work together and how everything is so coordinated, with very little effort.

No ant is selfish. They all serve the queen, and that is that. If they find some food, they either call on others to come or drag it into the nest, to share it with all. They always work in a very coordinated team and the stuff they do, you wonder how, with a body (hence brain), so small. Not to mention, they can lift about 10 times their body weight...wow!! Imagine humans were like that? Aaah, what would Earth be like now? I think much, much, much more advanced, that's for sure. There would be no crime, everyone would communicate without frustration, there would be less chaos everywhere, no wars...hmmm...what a life it would be.

Anyways, as this topic is not about ants, I will move on from my ant-theory and start the talk on...hang on what's the topic? *scrolls above*...ah yes, what impact us humans have had on this world. Righteo...here we go...

I think that the way everything turned out now is pretty much what you'd expect. Once you evolve into something that can basically do anything on earth and rule all other species, there's always going to be selfishness. I mean take yourself for example. If you were presented with $1 million, and someone said, "here ya go, it's yours. Do what you will with it." What would you do? Obviously, very few of us (some might), would actually say, "I want to use this money to help the struggling people in the poor nations. I want to give them food and water and their basic needs." Some might say they will, but when it happens, I'm sure not many would. Some people might donate some money, but keep a fair chunk to themselves. So yes, we are selfish, that's how we are now, but that's due to the way life has evolved.

The people on this planet are never going to agree with each other on what is the best thing to do for this planet and for our future. This is why war is started. If we were to all agree and live a great life without wars and conficts, we would be ants...hehe...sorry, I love the ants. No, no, seriously now, this planet could never have evolved into the dominant species all living without conflict. That's the way life is, everyone is different, everyone has their own opinions. If we were robots, we might see eye-to-eye on everything, but we are not. That is the essence of life, every being is different, thus, their needs and wants are obviously different. Keeping this in mind, how are we going to all be caring and sharing without wanting a greater slice of the pie for ourselves? It's just the way we are, it's the way all life is.

Cheeseness wrote:
Unfortunately few are with me when I say that perhaps in the interests of continuing life on this planet, we should (as a species) up and leave to make way for whatever new and interesting things might arise in our absence.

What an honourable cause; to sacrifice one's own for what is yet to come.

Yeah, but what if the dominant species that evolves is worse then us and they degrade the planet worse then we did? It's like trying to argue whether there's life out there in the universe, you just don't know. You cannot predict the future, as I like to say, anything is possible. You might like to think you can get a general idea of what will happen, but the fact is, the future is something you cannot predict.

Some1_Call_911 wrote:
Yeah, I think we are a selfish race but this is survival. Theres no such thing as "selfish" in the world survival. I don't see it as a bad thing that we take up most of the planets resources. Thanks to evolution we now need these things (medicine, cooked food, heat, etc.) to live a full 70 years. We are greedy when I put it like that but in order to live we must create lines of communication, construct buildings, produce energy and so on. People say things like "Oh we don't need TV or we don't need large homes or we don't need cars!" but I think that isn't true. It does impact the environment but since we have become so attached to technology and science it is our key to survival.

Just thought I'd say that I agree totally with you there. It's kinda similar to what I said above. To survive, you need to be a bit selfish...don't you? But then again...who knows. Who knows what we would be doing now if we had not been selfish...aaaah, don't you love the unknown?

Cheeseness wrote:
Anyone been paying any attention to that chunk-o-rock that's supposedly going to hit the earth in 20 odd years or something?
Anyone head about any of the fabulous plans to stop that from happening and saving the human race?
Anyone read STARK by Ben Elton?

Yeah, I have been watching on TV and reading about this meteor. It is very interesting to see what will happen over this 19-odd years. Hopefully, this thing will never hit our planet, but if it is in line to collide, these smart-brainy-scientists at NASA (or whatever company), better do their job right and save our planet!! I don't want to die!! But mind you, wouldn't it be fascinating to know how this planet would evolve after this thing hits and destroys nearly all life-forms on this planet? The hole evolution process would need to start from scratch again. But yet again...it's all a bunch of what-ifs...you just will never know.

Also, what's this STARK book (I assume it's a book) about?

Cheers,
Greg

Your ant theory is interesting, though ants do have wars between 'hives'. And if you take the 'hive' as a single organism, they, like most other entities on this planet, can be rather selfish when it comes to our own survival. Raymond E. Feist attempts to look at a 'hive' like dominant species in his Riftwar universe (fantasy based, not sci-fi). His results and projections are interesting.

liquid wrote: Yeah, but what if the dominant species that evoles is worse then us and they degrade the planet worse then we did? It's like trying to argue whether there's life out there in the universe, you just don't know. You cannot predict the future, as I like to say, anything is possible. You might like to think you can get a general idea of what will happen, but the fact is, the future is something you cannot predict.

It's really a question of ethics. I believe that the mere act of allowing the CHANCE for something new is honourable, worthy and desirable.
Just because I make one bad cheesecake doesn't mean I'm not going to eat it anyway and make another one (I eat a lot of cheesecakes when I can). Similarly, how better to understand our planet, the fundamentals of life and ecosystems as well as ourselves than through observation of our own home under circumstances where a new dominant life form comes into play.

On the meteor note, it has been prjected to miss us (and we do have computer systems capable of making these calculations, and we've got enough telescopes and technology to find out 90% of the variables, giving us a reasonably accurate estimation. It is suggested though, that this particular meteor has an orbit which brings it dangerously close to our own planet frequently (next one in 60 years, I think).

STARK is a great book (also made into a film of sorts, I believe). I'm reluctant to say anything other than 'Read it' because I would never like to be accused of giving away the plot of this story.

Ben Elton is a comedian. I do not know if his stand up history began before his writing, but needless to say, he's got a grasp on making some pretty interesting points and some pretty funny jokes at the same time.
The whole thrust behind STARK is that there is a conspiracy which is aware of the fact that the Earth is over polluted, and unrepairable, as well as being populated by millions of morons. The STARK Conspiracy, made up of cretinous rich blokes, plans to release a LOT of toxic waste and other nasties as a catalyst for Earth's downfally (which is going to happen anyway). They plan to leave the planet, and the come back once the Earth's achieved a new balance and all the morons are gone.

wehey! another discussion stolen from D6!
well at least you DID post a link this time.
't was maybe our ONLY succesful ID (intelligent discussion)
however I AM kinda tired with this discussion, especially seeing how you people agree too much. We just can't solve this discusssion it seems.

*thinks of something controversial*
*digs in memory*
ah yes, something I came up with few years ago:
Why do WE eat cows?
because we are SUPERIOR to cows!
Why do we fight wars?
to show WHICH of the two races/nations is SUPERIOR!
Why did we survive evolution, and our own destruction of the earth?
Because we are SUPERIOR!

So, this alien race invades (no stupid, but JZ, that's impossible comment please)
We as humans want to proof we're superior, once again, so we fight them, in a war. After a while, they do something SO devastating to us, almost ALL faith in us is lost. They are SUPERIOR! ofcourse, you could do the honourable thing, and keep fighting till the end.

However, they are just after your (for example) soul, and our planet.
they'll get the planmet from the war, it's theirs now. However, they stop fighting the war, and give EVERY human being left the option to fight on (and probably be killed some day later) or let him be sacrificed to the SUPERIOR new race, NOW. no fight, just admit you're the weakest of the two species.

What would you do?

(yes.. too much text, I know)

- Edited By JZ On Sat 14th, Sep 2002 @ 5:04am

i would like to point out the fact that the human race HAS been evolving. for example, ppl today are quite a bit taller than they were. they may or may not have as much strength however. i think that yes, we are raping and pillaging our planet, but, so what? the earth wont die, it will just change form. its sorta like when the moon was formed (theory here, dont attack me for it!). a planet in between mars and jupiter was somehow destroyed (see: fragged) and a large portion of it struck the earth dead on (large portion=2/3 size of earth). Now, this huge chunk naturally tore the surface of the planet into pieces, and spewed out a large chunk of lava, which fell into orbit as the moon. now if a huge chunk like that smacked into tha earth, yes, life would be extinguished as we know it, but the planet would remain, and who knows? it might eventually come back to the same position as it is now, as some species wields tools, and destroys the earth like it is now, it will still survive, no matter how bad (exception might b to frag the earth, but that aint liekly to happen.

edit: believe that the big chunk thing came from actually two planets that collided (resulted also in asteroid belt)

- Edited By PsychoFarmer On Thu 10th, Oct 2002 @ 10:09pm

PsychoFarmer wrote:
i think that yes, we are raping and pillaging our planet, but, so what? the earth wont die, it will just change form.

i believe that is a very selfish attitude you have there. I am shocked at how the world has been damaged. Global warming has changed the natural cycle of the world, so that now, here in Australia, we are totally in drought. I want my children, and future generations to be able to live without water restrictions, or be able to actually see wild animals, or be able to go out in a boat and actually catch decent fish.

and i like that moon theory. Totally ridiculous, but a good read Far too much of it was based on chance, and i believe even a 2/3 size of earth rock would cause significant damage to destroy earth totally

I watched the Matrix last night, and one scene involved an agent saying how he hated earth for various reasons, mainly :

"Humans populate and breed and area, using the resources to the limit, until theres none left, only to move onto a bigger and better area and do the same again" and it's so true, we unlike most animals, mammals, lifeforms, organisms dont adapt to live with the enviroment we use it until its gone, its barren and its a wasteland, that is why we will eventually either have to : move or die out.

man, it seems like everyone watched the Matrix last night. So many references to it i've lost track.

Too many of today's generations take things for granted. Food, water, stable climates, life in general. And it seems people don't care about the future.

But i don't want to have to tell my grandchildren in the future about times in the "olden days" when there were fish in the sea, when there were plenty of animals in the wild, when water was a readily available source and when global warming was in its early stages. i want them to be able to see and experience this for themselves.

M@t wrote: man, it seems like everyone watched the Matrix last night. So many references to it i've lost track.

Too many of today's generations take things for granted. Food, water, stable climates, life in general. And it seems people don't care about the future.

But i don't want to have to tell my grandchildren in the future about times in the "olden days" when there were fish in the sea, when there were plenty of animals in the wild, when water was a readily available source and when global warming was in its early stages. i want them to be able to see and experience this for themselves.

THERE IS NO SPOON! sorry but that was the best line of the whole damn film

I think the human race has the idea that were all gonna jump in a big rocket and go live on some perfect planet, NAHA, what will happen is before we even get the technology todo that we'll die from global warming.

from the matrix, all the world can be judged

from the Matrix, "i love you Neo"