Battle.Net StarCraft2 allows Mods to be sold. Thread

	Posts
Battle.Net StarCraft2 allows Mods to be sold. (Forums : Development Banter : Battle.Net StarCraft2 allows Mods to be sold.)	Post Reply
Thread Options	1 2
Mr_Cyberpunk Game Developer	Sep 15 2009, 6:45pm Anchor
Kotaku.com This could be really really big for a lot of mod teams, its also great that finally Original TCs are going to get more incentives now- so hopefully no more "StarGate" mods. I'm really looking forward to seeing what mod developers do with this idea, if it takes off I would love nothing more than for game developers to support this. I think they've solved the DLC problem right there, there is no need for the developer to make content now, they should just focus on making their games less buggy and more optimized.. we'll handle the rest so long as it pays . Best idea ever! Now if Unreal, ZeniMax, Crytek and Valve did this it would be awesome.
O N L I N E Toyoka What's that all aboot, eh?	Sep 15 2009, 10:11pm Anchor
Jaw Drops Best news I've heard yet. Good job Blizzard, they're finally going to do some good for us modders (who will be modding SC2 that is ). Now if only they will do this with Diablo III.. then... then I would kiss Blizzard's feet -- ~Toyoka's Gaming Channel~
shadowofamn 3D Artist	Sep 15 2009, 10:34pm Anchor
Starcraft 1 was awesome, the map editor allows alot of good maps to be made, wc3 was no exception. Cant wait for SC2 Edited by: shadowofamn
Mr_Cyberpunk Game Developer	Sep 15 2009, 11:23pm Anchor
Someone wrote:Now if only they will do this with Diablo III.. then... then I would kiss Blizzard's feet If they did that would be epic, I'd love to make a few RPGs with it. --
Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D	Sep 16 2009, 3:41am Anchor
oh god >_> i don't see anything good coming off this i am not gonna pay for single maps :/ it depends on the price to so i'm gonna hold my ranting until something is known about the pricing -- Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details
Mr_Cyberpunk Game Developer	Sep 16 2009, 5:32am Anchor
relax, it won't be that bad.. Its likely Blizzard will mediate what they allow and what they don't allow to make money off their games- and I'd assume that they'll be very strict about it- because I understand that a lot of mods might be completely crap and doesn't justify paying that kind of money. But I mean ModDB is supposed to be here to help you filter though half of it. And the other half is hearing from their community the sorts of complaints ect about a particular mod. On the plus side though it means that Modding can actually be considered a business and an industry now.
ambershee Nimbusfish Rawks	Sep 16 2009, 10:34am Anchor
I have a horrible feeling that nothing good can come of this in the long run. They're basically try to turn mods into the new 'DLC'.
Range_Finder	Sep 16 2009, 11:00am Anchor
Im with Sigma and Ambershee on this i cant see any good coming of it either.
Gibberstein Generic Coder Type Thing	Sep 16 2009, 12:53pm Anchor
It's going to get messy when it comes to beta testing - are all those volunteers who helped polish the rough edges off the pre-commercial version going to get a cut? I suspect not, which will certainly make people a lot less willing to volunteer for said role. On a related note, does this mean SC2 modders won't release a version outside of a small, trusted circle of people so there isn't an inconvienient almost-final beta floating round for free when they put the final version on sale? It smells like we're going to get a vicious circle - no-one's going to want to release anything so they can get the maximum profit from the commercial release, and very little is going to be picked for commercial release because there's going to be so few people getting the level of polish required as they're not getting enough testing. So much potential for messy, tangled disaster here, and if Blizzard can navigate through this they're truly geniuses. -- "lets say Portal is a puzzle game, so its a rehash of Tetris" - Wraiyth points out the craziness of stereotyping games by their genre
Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D	Sep 16 2009, 2:47pm Anchor
ambershee wrote:I have a horrible feeling that nothing good can come of this in the long run. They're basically try to turn mods into the new 'DLC'. thats what i was thinking let someone else do it :/ they will probably charge something to to host the map >_> besides, if a map turns out to be popular, then you are forced to buy it if you want to keep playing mp, because alot of people will have the map, kinda lame imo :/ -- Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details
ambershee Nimbusfish Rawks	Sep 16 2009, 6:42pm Anchor
I expect that they 'publish' it via their online storefront, and probably take a heavy cut of the profits. I'm sure something stinks in here somewhere.
Mr_Cyberpunk Game Developer	Sep 16 2009, 9:23pm Anchor
Yeah I'll admit there's no way a company owned by Activision will be fair to its modding community if modders can make some kind of money from Some mods do deserve to get paid due to their quality, others however don't. however at least its better than DLC, DLC is often always guaranteed to suck. I've not seen a DLC that I paid for which has lived up to what it promises, nor have I understood the point of DLC over Expansions. I'm all for modders being paid to do what they do, I'm not however for bastard publishers exploiting them for the privilege of using their engine. Besides I think this is just an attempt to stop "spin-off" stand alone games from happening, we've seen this happen to Warcraft 3- so I guess Blizzard wants in on that money. It could in fact be a much better option to go the Killing Floor/Gary's Mod path over this one. Realistically they should be creating a modders license and that's it.. I don't think anyone wants Battle.net to become the next Steam. Edited by: Mr_Cyberpunk
Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D	Sep 17 2009, 2:01am Anchor
DLC are not expansions in that sense more like extra optional tidbits or larger i think the idea is good, but the execution aint :p there are allot of people complaining that the dlc sucks, then again, they want you to buy it, but you don't have to :3 most DLC feels more like payed patches, but thats not the point. Look at rock band for example, you can get extra songs so you have more songs to play i think they have pulled it off the best...mostly Quote:I don't think anyone wants Battle.net to become the next Steam. to late for that i guess, they smelled profit, now go in for the kill here's what i expect to see -> LOADS of dota maps its like CS, its popular, so everyone tries to make it in the hopes to cash in :/ -- Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details
Mr_Cyberpunk Game Developer	Sep 17 2009, 7:29pm Anchor
yep because Dota RUINED WC3.. yes I said it. you've got stand alone games now.. don't make mods for dota any more. I agree with you. --
Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D	Sep 18 2009, 5:34am Anchor
while dota aint bad..its just alot of people say it, everyone abandoned wc3 for dota, the wc3 ladders are dead then again, it aint that great either, they all go "DOTA IS INFINITLY REPLAYABLE!!!!" it has 1 map...you want to win so you use a proven tactic... so yeah, no >_> -- Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details
aerozol	Sep 27 2009, 5:30pm Anchor
Hey, DotA is a great mod. This will be good news, but only if there's some good, relatively cheap stuff (or freebies) mixed into the mix. DLC isn't great, if you don't have to pay for all of it. Giving the modders the choice of how to release it and what to charge will hopefully give the consumer a lot of choices as well. If everything has to be payed for, someone will just hack it, and torrent everything (as usual). Hopefully things work out.
Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D	Sep 28 2009, 3:51am Anchor
Quote:Giving the modders the choice of how to release it and what to charge will hopefully give the consumer a lot of choices as well. chances are everyone will charge for theyr mod >_> and like i said, dota aint bad, its just average imo but, they try to make a dota mod for every single game, since the starcraft2 editor is quite powerfull, this will be easy to make then so we will get flooded by dota copies, one after the other, and we prolly all have to pay for them :/ -- Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details
overneathe	Oct 10 2009, 4:12am Anchor
Friendly bump. Now before anyone reads this post please know I'm a friendly person and with these words I do not mean to harm anyone. It's just opinions after all. :] I've been following Moddb for I don't know how long, I think something like 5 years now. Back in the day I used to do Starcraft maps, then Warcraft maps and mods and finally some pretty impressive (though it sounds a bit selfish) Titan Quest mods. The last 2 games included minor code changes, model changes and heavy texture changes/creation. Now, what I mean by this is _not_ that I'm a pro at this stuff but I think I know what a mod means and the processes behind development. Sadly these last few years I haven't the time to do any mod creation but then again you guys are doing wonderful so I can just chill and play what you did instead of sweating myself. :p And I have to say, the last 3-5 years modding has becoming just otherworldly. These days you can add 3 whole games into one guy with just a single mod that is created by talented people. And this site contains hundreds (if not thousands) of them, thankfully. But what this post was about was Starcraft 2. Mostly the editor. I was just wondering. Did you guys see the Blizzcon trailer? Did anyone catch a glimpse of the SC2 editor preview? Cause from what I read it's all about the money for you guys. From what I remember back when I was (a very small but still) a part of this community it was all about the mods. And then some people loved doing mods and were great at them, so they put up a donation button to see if they can get some money for doing what they love so that then they can do it even more. Considering there's profit in it. Ok I stretched it a bit too fast. Let's get back on the editor. Hopefully some of you have seen it. Have you noticed that Uberlisk? A creature made up entirely in the editor. Made of many parts of zerg? With custom skills and all that stuff? Or perhaps the third person shooter involving Nova going into the underground and inside buildings on an RTS map? Camera following cursor? Well you could've at least seen the Space Invaders type mod? No? None of these? Well then I absolutely understand why you guys talk about the new feature that some mod makers will receive money for their work (which doesn't really sound bad to me). But if you've seen at least one of these 3 videos of mods that were made by the devs on their own engine in only a few hours during lunch breaks and such... well I'm not sure why you guys aren't celebrating the coming of a new age of modding. I thought I'd find hundreds of people screaming over here that have had the ideas but could never find a team or the time to realize them. Instead there's one topic with a few people complaining Blizzard are starting to give to modders. Now I understand your concerns. I did read the comments in here. But just how valid are your arguments. There will be and I quote "A few selected mods chosen to be made downloadable content with a small purchase cost with part of the money going to the moder/team". Of course, the top 10/100/1000 mods will have a buy key. Of let's say $2. Is it really that much of a sacrifice? Now that finally the problem with mods won't be How to implement something. It will be What to implement. It will be all about the ideas, because the tools are all there. Oh and yeah, indeed, no one is asking you to download anything. No one is making you. The thing with "I MUST buy it because everyone else has it" is actually what's wrong with this society and it's why other mp3 players fail compared to iPod. Because everyone else has one. Think for yourself. :] Sorry again for the lame wall of flame post but I'm a big fan of both SC2 and modding so it kinda grinds my gears to see such things. Again, no harm intended at anyone. :] I'd post a link to the video but your security measures are against it. So just go to our favorite video site and type "starcraft 2 editor".
Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D	Oct 10 2009, 5:51am Anchor
Quote:Oh and yeah, indeed, no one is asking you to download anything. No one is making you. play a mp game without popular map A, and you won't get into any :/ the thing is, if a map becomes realy popular, so popular everyone needs it, then you are allmost required to buy the map, just because the chances that you will encounter a game with that map will be extremely high ive seen the trailer for the SC2 map editor, i found it pretty impresive to. BUT, this ain't about the editor, but about the fact that you can sell them it has been brought up multiple times, youl get the CS syndrome: someone makes a map that becomes vastly popular, so he earns alot of money because of it BUT, then other people start to think "hmm, he made alot of money with it, i want in" so he makes a rehash of the map but he aint the only one, so the map shop will be flooded with clones of that popular map take a look at mods over here, all fps games have at least 1 CS clone, or any other "realistic" modern day terrorist vs counter terrorist mod THAT is what is bothering me allso, you mentioned 2$ for a map. i find that: A. allot of money, for a map maybe no one plays B. you don't have quality control, you are not allowed to playtest the map, so the map maker can take all cool screenshots and epic description, but when you open it up in game, it sucks C. the aforementioned clones, they can make it look different, but in the end its a rehash of popular map A :/ D. DOTA...nothing wrong with it, but allot of people will recreate it :/ so youl end up with dota maps all over the place (allso, see C and the text above) That everything makes pusrchasing a map for just 2$ a big deal imo that and conversion rates if they do $ = € (for example) then we will be paying more 2$ = 1.35€ with the current exchange rates but they will charge us 2$, wich is completely unfair if you are not living in the US :/ -- Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details
overneathe	Oct 10 2009, 6:03am Anchor
No, no, my friend. You still misunderstand the quote. Blizzard are deciding if the map will make it to premium content. You can't just press a button and make people pay for it. That's what I meant in general. There will be DotA maps, but onlt 1-2% of all of them will be played because let's face it, only 1-2% of them will be any good. Now that you have this info, I'll be glad to hear your new statement. Also on the dollar to euro part. It sucks and it will suck for several more years till the dollar is completely extinct. But till then... we'll just have to suck it up. It's sad I know.
ambershee Nimbusfish Rawks	Oct 10 2009, 6:18am Anchor
I don't see how it works in reality; if Blizzard make the previously free version, something you have to pay for, then that's an arse move. It has to be 'paid for' content from the start. Either way, this is still a bad move. Encouraging developers to try and make money for their mods is just going to result in a sour taste for all involved. No company should be making a profit from what used to be hobbyist work that they're not involved in, it's just plain wrong.
Yithian	Oct 10 2009, 9:56am Anchor
Game companies are starting to look at modding as a potential revenue stream. Personally, I don't think there's anything wrong with that; it's just going to be another game type like DLC or expansions, just somewhere between DLC and free mods. Whether or not some people end up with a sour taste is irrelevant: if the tools are there, people will use them. And I'm willing to bet there are a lot of modders who would jump at the chance to use a robust development tool and get paid for it and not give a molerat's ass that Blizzard is taking a cut. It gives them cash, exposure, and a bullet-point on their resume when they apply for a job at the big game companies. And no company is going to invest time and money in a toolset for modders without expecting some kind of cash gain. I know a lot of modders who would pay money for a bug-free toolset for Oblivion of Fallout3 with full technical support. Blizzard is just ahead of the game. Premium maps are cheap for the company and a genuine selling point for the game. I know people who bought Oblivion on console and then bought a PC version just for the mods. That's two sales on one game. Mods do help sell games. As far as the quality goes and the number of clones that get made for popular maps that's just part and parcel for the entire industry. How many clones get made by big companies every year? How many of them suck? Why would anyone expect this to be different. It's the same with free mods. It's just the nature of the industry. For that matter, it's the nature of every industry. It's what we call capitalism. Whether this turns out to be a good or bad thing depends on the integrity and creativity of the people involved. Which isn't really saying anything at all. Besides, it's not really going to affect most modders all that much. Most modders will mod the games they like the way they want whether or not they get paid for it. Who am I to begrudge a talented modder a few dollars for hundreds of hours of unpaid toil or a company like Blizzard a few dollars for making it possible?
Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D	Oct 10 2009, 10:41am Anchor
ambershee wrote:No company should be making a profit from what used to be hobbyist work that they're not involved in, it's just plain wrong. i second this motion -- Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details
Yithian	Oct 10 2009, 10:54am Anchor
If the people making the mod voluntarily agree to the conditions, it's no longer a hobby, as far as they're concerned. I agree that companies should not be making a profit from free labor, but the whole point of the new arrangement is to provide an alternative. If the mod developers decide they like the terms of the agreement, why not? No one is forcing them to make the mod. Companies are already indirectly making a profit from mod developers through increased shelf-life on their products anyway. Most of the mod community is still going to be hobbyist-run and driven in any case.
Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D	Oct 10 2009, 11:56am Anchor
IF they want to have the map/mod makers get money, use donations if you like it, you can donate i mean, wow addons have this to, people devote alot of time writing and testing them. There is a button wich says you CAN donate if you want to and i haven't heard anyone complaining that no one does that. The "profits" range from 1$ to sometimes 50$ but in this way you are not forced to pay + it keeps the mentality of user made content -- Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details

Thread Options

1 2

Mr_Cyberpunk Game Developer

Sep 15 2009, 6:45pm Anchor

Kotaku.com

This could be really really big for a lot of mod teams, its also great that finally Original TCs are going to get more incentives now- so hopefully no more "StarGate" mods.

I'm really looking forward to seeing what mod developers do with this idea, if it takes off I would love nothing more than for game developers to support this. I think they've solved the DLC problem right there, there is no need for the developer to make content now, they should just focus on making their games less buggy and more optimized.. we'll handle the rest so long as it pays .

Best idea ever! Now if Unreal, ZeniMax, Crytek and Valve did this it would be awesome.

O
N
L
I
N
E

Toyoka What's that all aboot, eh?

Sep 15 2009, 10:11pm Anchor

*Jaw Drops*

Best news I've heard yet. Good job Blizzard, they're finally going to do some good for us modders (who will be modding SC2 that is ). Now if only they will do this with Diablo III.. then... then I would kiss Blizzard's feet

--

~Toyoka's Gaming Channel~

shadowofamn 3D Artist

Sep 15 2009, 10:34pm Anchor

Starcraft 1 was awesome, the map editor allows alot of good maps to be made, wc3 was no exception. Cant wait for SC2

Edited by: shadowofamn

Mr_Cyberpunk Game Developer

Sep 15 2009, 11:23pm Anchor

Someone wrote:Now if only they will do this with Diablo III.. then... then I would kiss Blizzard's feet

If they did that would be epic, I'd love to make a few RPGs with it.

--

Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D

Sep 16 2009, 3:41am Anchor

oh god >_> i don't see anything good coming off this
i am not gonna pay for single maps :/ it depends on the price to
so i'm gonna hold my ranting until something is known about the pricing

--

Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details

Mr_Cyberpunk Game Developer

Sep 16 2009, 5:32am Anchor

relax, it won't be that bad.. Its likely Blizzard will mediate what they allow and what they don't allow to make money off their games- and I'd assume that they'll be very strict about it- because I understand that a lot of mods might be completely crap and doesn't justify paying that kind of money.

But I mean ModDB is supposed to be here to help you filter though half of it. And the other half is hearing from their community the sorts of complaints ect about a particular mod.

On the plus side though it means that Modding can actually be considered a business and an industry now.

ambershee Nimbusfish Rawks

Sep 16 2009, 10:34am Anchor

I have a horrible feeling that nothing good can come of this in the long run. They're basically try to turn mods into the new 'DLC'.

Range_Finder

Sep 16 2009, 11:00am Anchor

Im with Sigma and Ambershee on this i cant see any good coming of it either.

Gibberstein Generic Coder Type Thing

Sep 16 2009, 12:53pm Anchor

It's going to get messy when it comes to beta testing - are all those volunteers who helped polish the rough edges off the pre-commercial version going to get a cut? I suspect not, which will certainly make people a lot less willing to volunteer for said role. On a related note, does this mean SC2 modders won't release a version outside of a small, trusted circle of people so there isn't an inconvienient almost-final beta floating round for free when they put the final version on sale? It smells like we're going to get a vicious circle - no-one's going to want to release anything so they can get the maximum profit from the commercial release, and very little is going to be picked for commercial release because there's going to be so few people getting the level of polish required as they're not getting enough testing. So much potential for messy, tangled disaster here, and if Blizzard can navigate through this they're truly geniuses.

--

"lets say Portal is a puzzle game, so its a rehash of Tetris"
- Wraiyth points out the craziness of stereotyping games by their genre

Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D

Sep 16 2009, 2:47pm Anchor

ambershee wrote:I have a horrible feeling that nothing good can come of this in the long run. They're basically try to turn mods into the new 'DLC'.

thats what i was thinking
let someone else do it :/ they will probably charge something to to host the map >_>
besides, if a map turns out to be popular, then you are forced to buy it if you want to keep playing mp, because alot of people will have the map, kinda lame imo :/

--

Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details

ambershee Nimbusfish Rawks

Sep 16 2009, 6:42pm Anchor

I expect that they 'publish' it via their online storefront, and probably take a heavy cut of the profits. I'm sure something stinks in here somewhere.

Mr_Cyberpunk Game Developer

Sep 16 2009, 9:23pm Anchor

Yeah I'll admit there's no way a company owned by Activision will be fair to its modding community if modders can make some kind of money from

Some mods do deserve to get paid due to their quality, others however don't. however at least its better than DLC, DLC is often always guaranteed to suck. I've not seen a DLC that I paid for which has lived up to what it promises, nor have I understood the point of DLC over Expansions.

I'm all for modders being paid to do what they do, I'm not however for bastard publishers exploiting them for the privilege of using their engine. Besides I think this is just an attempt to stop "spin-off" stand alone games from happening, we've seen this happen to Warcraft 3- so I guess Blizzard wants in on that money. It could in fact be a much better option to go the Killing Floor/Gary's Mod path over this one.

Realistically they should be creating a modders license and that's it.. I don't think anyone wants Battle.net to become the next Steam.

Edited by: Mr_Cyberpunk

Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D

Sep 17 2009, 2:01am Anchor

DLC are not expansions in that sense
more like extra optional tidbits or larger
i think the idea is good, but the execution aint :p there are allot of people complaining that the dlc sucks, then again, they want you to buy it, but you don't have to :3
most DLC feels more like payed patches, but thats not the point.
Look at rock band for example, you can get extra songs so you have more songs to play
i think they have pulled it off the best...mostly

Quote:I don't think anyone wants Battle.net to become the next Steam.

to late for that i guess, they smelled profit, now go in for the kill
here's what i expect to see -> LOADS of dota maps
its like CS, its popular, so everyone tries to make it in the hopes to cash in :/

--

Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details

Mr_Cyberpunk Game Developer

Sep 17 2009, 7:29pm Anchor

yep because Dota RUINED WC3.. yes I said it. you've got stand alone games now.. don't make mods for dota any more.

I agree with you.

--

Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D

Sep 18 2009, 5:34am Anchor

while dota aint bad..its just
alot of people say it, everyone abandoned wc3 for dota, the wc3 ladders are dead
then again, it aint that great either, they all go "DOTA IS INFINITLY REPLAYABLE!!!!"
it has 1 map...you want to win so you use a proven tactic... so yeah, no >_>

--

Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details

aerozol

Sep 27 2009, 5:30pm Anchor

Hey, DotA is a great mod.

This will be good news, but only if there's some good, relatively cheap stuff (or freebies) mixed into the mix.
DLC isn't great, if you don't have to pay for all of it. Giving the modders the choice of how to release it and what to charge will hopefully give the consumer a lot of choices as well.
If everything has to be payed for, someone will just hack it, and torrent everything (as usual). Hopefully things work out.

Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D

Sep 28 2009, 3:51am Anchor

Quote:Giving the modders the choice of how to release it and what to charge will hopefully give the consumer a lot of choices as well.

chances are everyone will charge for theyr mod >_>
and like i said, dota aint bad, its just average imo
but, they try to make a dota mod for every single game, since the starcraft2 editor is quite powerfull, this will be easy to make then
so we will get flooded by dota copies, one after the other, and we prolly all have to pay for them :/

--

Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details

overneathe

Oct 10 2009, 4:12am Anchor

Friendly bump.

Now before anyone reads this post please know I'm a friendly person and with these words I do not mean to harm anyone. It's just opinions after all. :]

I've been following Moddb for I don't know how long, I think something like 5 years now. Back in the day I used to do Starcraft maps, then Warcraft maps and mods and finally some pretty impressive (though it sounds a bit selfish) Titan Quest mods. The last 2 games included minor code changes, model changes and heavy texture changes/creation. Now, what I mean by this is _not_ that I'm a pro at this stuff but I think I know what a mod means and the processes behind development. Sadly these last few years I haven't the time to do any mod creation but then again you guys are doing wonderful so I can just chill and play what you did instead of sweating myself. :p

And I have to say, the last 3-5 years modding has becoming just otherworldly. These days you can add 3 whole games into one guy with just a single mod that is created by talented people. And this site contains hundreds (if not thousands) of them, thankfully.

But what this post was about was Starcraft 2. Mostly the editor.

I was just wondering. Did you guys see the Blizzcon trailer? Did anyone catch a glimpse of the SC2 editor preview? Cause from what I read it's all about the money for you guys. From what I remember back when I was (a very small but still) a part of this community it was all about the mods. And then some people loved doing mods and were great at them, so they put up a donation button to see if they can get some money for doing what they love so that then they can do it even more. Considering there's profit in it.

Ok I stretched it a bit too fast. Let's get back on the editor. Hopefully some of you have seen it. Have you noticed that Uberlisk? A creature made up entirely in the editor. Made of many parts of zerg? With custom skills and all that stuff? Or perhaps the third person shooter involving Nova going into the underground and inside buildings on an RTS map? Camera following cursor? Well you could've at least seen the Space Invaders type mod? No? None of these?

Well then I absolutely understand why you guys talk about the new feature that some mod makers will receive money for their work (which doesn't really sound bad to me).

But if you've seen at least one of these 3 videos of mods that were made by the devs on their own engine in only a few hours during lunch breaks and such... well I'm not sure why you guys aren't celebrating the coming of a new age of modding.

I thought I'd find hundreds of people screaming over here that have had the ideas but could never find a team or the time to realize them. Instead there's one topic with a few people complaining Blizzard are starting to give to modders.

Now I understand your concerns. I did read the comments in here. But just how valid are your arguments. There will be and I quote "A few selected mods chosen to be made downloadable content with a small purchase cost with part of the money going to the moder/team". Of course, the top 10/100/1000 mods will have a buy key. Of let's say $2. Is it really that much of a sacrifice?

Now that finally the problem with mods won't be How to implement something. It will be What to implement. It will be all about the ideas, because the tools are all there.

Oh and yeah, indeed, no one is asking you to download anything. No one is making you. The thing with "I MUST buy it because everyone else has it" is actually what's wrong with this society and it's why other mp3 players fail compared to iPod. Because everyone else has one. Think for yourself. :]

Sorry again for the lame wall of flame post but I'm a big fan of both SC2 and modding so it kinda grinds my gears to see such things. Again, no harm intended at anyone. :]

I'd post a link to the video but your security measures are against it. So just go to our favorite video site and type "starcraft 2 editor".

Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D

Oct 10 2009, 5:51am Anchor

Quote:Oh and yeah, indeed, no one is asking you to download anything. No one is making you.

play a mp game without popular map A, and you won't get into any :/
the thing is, if a map becomes realy popular, so popular everyone needs it, then you are allmost required to buy the map, just because the chances that you will encounter a game with that map will be extremely high

ive seen the trailer for the SC2 map editor, i found it pretty impresive to.
BUT, this ain't about the editor, but about the fact that you can sell them
it has been brought up multiple times, youl get the CS syndrome:
someone makes a map that becomes vastly popular, so he earns alot of money because of it
BUT, then other people start to think "hmm, he made alot of money with it, i want in" so he makes a rehash of the map
but he aint the only one, so the map shop will be flooded with clones of that popular map
take a look at mods over here, all fps games have at least 1 CS clone, or any other "realistic" modern day terrorist vs counter terrorist mod

THAT is what is bothering me
allso, you mentioned 2$ for a map.
i find that:
A. allot of money, for a map maybe no one plays
B. you don't have quality control, you are not allowed to playtest the map, so the map maker can take all cool screenshots and epic description, but when you open it up in game, it sucks
C. the aforementioned clones, they can make it look different, but in the end its a rehash of popular map A :/
D. DOTA...nothing wrong with it, but allot of people will recreate it :/ so youl end up with dota maps all over the place (allso, see C and the text above)

That everything makes pusrchasing a map for just 2$ a big deal imo
that and conversion rates
if they do $ = € (for example) then we will be paying more
2$ = 1.35€ with the current exchange rates
but they will charge us 2$, wich is completely unfair if you are not living in the US :/

--

Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details

overneathe

Oct 10 2009, 6:03am Anchor

No, no, my friend. You still misunderstand the quote. Blizzard are deciding if the map will make it to premium content. You can't just press a button and make people pay for it. That's what I meant in general. There will be DotA maps, but onlt 1-2% of all of them will be played because let's face it, only 1-2% of them will be any good.
Now that you have this info, I'll be glad to hear your new statement.
Also on the dollar to euro part. It sucks and it will suck for several more years till the dollar is completely extinct. But till then... we'll just have to suck it up. It's sad I know.

ambershee Nimbusfish Rawks

Oct 10 2009, 6:18am Anchor

I don't see how it works in reality; if Blizzard make the previously free version, something you have to pay for, then that's an arse move. It has to be 'paid for' content from the start. Either way, this is still a bad move. Encouraging developers to try and make money for their mods is just going to result in a sour taste for all involved. No company should be making a profit from what used to be hobbyist work that they're not involved in, it's just plain wrong.

Yithian

Oct 10 2009, 9:56am Anchor

Game companies are starting to look at modding as a potential revenue stream. Personally, I don't think there's anything wrong with that; it's just going to be another game type like DLC or expansions, just somewhere between DLC and free mods. Whether or not some people end up with a sour taste is irrelevant: if the tools are there, people will use them.

And I'm willing to bet there are a lot of modders who would jump at the chance to use a robust development tool and get paid for it and not give a molerat's ass that Blizzard is taking a cut. It gives them cash, exposure, and a bullet-point on their resume when they apply for a job at the big game companies. And no company is going to invest time and money in a toolset for modders without expecting some kind of cash gain. I know a lot of modders who would pay money for a bug-free toolset for Oblivion of Fallout3 with full technical support. Blizzard is just ahead of the game. Premium maps are cheap for the company and a genuine selling point for the game. I know people who bought Oblivion on console and then bought a PC version just for the mods. That's two sales on one game. Mods do help sell games.

As far as the quality goes and the number of clones that get made for popular maps that's just part and parcel for the entire industry. How many clones get made by big companies every year? How many of them suck? Why would anyone expect this to be different. It's the same with free mods. It's just the nature of the industry. For that matter, it's the nature of every industry. It's what we call capitalism. Whether this turns out to be a good or bad thing depends on the integrity and creativity of the people involved. Which isn't really saying anything at all.

Besides, it's not really going to affect most modders all that much. Most modders will mod the games they like the way they want whether or not they get paid for it. Who am I to begrudge a talented modder a few dollars for hundreds of hours of unpaid toil or a company like Blizzard a few dollars for making it possible?

Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D

Oct 10 2009, 10:41am Anchor

ambershee wrote:No company should be making a profit from what used to be hobbyist work that they're not involved in, it's just plain wrong.

i second this motion

--

Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details

Yithian

Oct 10 2009, 10:54am Anchor

If the people making the mod voluntarily agree to the conditions, it's no longer a hobby, as far as they're concerned. I agree that companies should not be making a profit from free labor, but the whole point of the new arrangement is to provide an alternative. If the mod developers decide they like the terms of the agreement, why not? No one is forcing them to make the mod. Companies are already indirectly making a profit from mod developers through increased shelf-life on their products anyway. Most of the mod community is still going to be hobbyist-run and driven in any case.

Sigma Resident Stepmania Freak :D

Oct 10 2009, 11:56am Anchor

IF they want to have the map/mod makers get money, use donations
if you like it, you can donate
i mean, wow addons have this to, people devote alot of time writing and testing them. There is a button wich says you CAN donate if you want to and i haven't heard anyone complaining that no one does that. The "profits" range from 1$ to sometimes 50$ but in this way you are not forced to pay + it keeps the mentality of user made content

--

Looking for musicians for unannounced project, PM me for further details